Denninger, have you lost your mind?

[thoward]

"All health providers must publish a price list and may not bill or accept payment at anything other than that price; doing so becomes a violation of Robinson-Patman and exposes the provider to civil suit for treble damages. This instantly stops the practice of billing the uninsured or privately insured at a higher price than Medicare, for example - a practice that is rampant, particularly among hospitals. Every hospital has a detailed price list for every function and thing in their health care panoply - this enforces even billing and even pricing for everyone, without discrimination. The complaint that health providers cannot make a living at Medicare's reimbursement rates does not give that provider license to cost shift the expense of government-subsidized care to privately-insured or uninsured patients. That sort of discrimination is outrageous and must be made unlawful."

What happened to free market? Yes, we should have a stated price but be alowed to discount for volume or decreased expences. Florida says our auto injury rates can not excede 200% of medicare. The paper work involved in an auto claim is much more involved so we make more money. My selfpay patients pay about the same as Medicare as there is no billing so they get a discount. Blue cross represents a large portion of my patients and they get a break because of volume.

I was very surprised to see you write this. Also this should remain a State issue not a Federal.

Personally I think we need a min of 2500 deductible with catastrophic insurance. This puts some skin in the game for patients which in turn will reduce fraud. It also will increase doctor competition for patient dollars which will help decrease costs.

Got to go but would like to hear more

 

[krush]

My dad said when he was growing up, the doctor came to him at his house.

That's what I want!

 

[Boatsb]

Tod the idea of published pricing being fair seems to be missing.

In Pro Video the List price of tape is usually 5x dealer cost. Add in volume and program money and the end user buys it at or below published COST and the dealer gets 15% behind the lines. Anyone buying at list is screwed.

If a procedure was $1,000 before medicaid discount and other programs should the final cost be $100 while the other insurance companies pay $500 and someone who did not know any better pays $1,000.

Body shops have a standard cost for each procedure and all the insurance companies pay the same "procedure fee" at their hourly rate which runs up and down only a few percent.

 

[thoward]

Tod the idea of published pricing being fair seems to be missing.
If a procedure was $1,000 before medicaid discount and other programs should the final cost be $100 while the other insurance companies pay $500 and someone who did not know any better pays $1,000.
.

You are going to end up screwing the consumer. Most places give a "point of service" discount fot those that pay up front. No billing, no hastles, guarenteed cash, providers can give big discounts for that. Other cases may be in litigation for years and there should be no discount for those. The rising cost of health care in large part is due to the way insurance is provided.

We must get consumers back to paying out of their own pockets, atleast for basic health care. There also has to be a penalty for abusing your health.

 

[skindr]

Will anyone please explain to me why taxpayers are not demanding nothing less than the exact same health ins. that congressmen get ? Who are they but overpaid public servants to get anything more than I get or you get ? Grow some cajones, people !

 

[Boatsb]

Taxpayers are not the ones I am worried about. If Taxpayers get that what about the non tax payers?

Why should the top 20% of the earners carry the 80% who want equality of benefits but are not able or willing to pay for it.

let people determine the care they get by the amount they contribute. Non contributors will get basic care and nothing more. If they want more there is a way to get it. A JOB.

 

[skindr]

Have you not realized what Obama meant when he chanted let's "redistribute the wealth"? That's why the 20% will carry the rest. A few more facts from the reign of the mighty Obama: Nowhere in the health care plan is there any statement eliminating the illegal ignorants from any of its benefits, so beware. No society on this planet has ever made the poor richer by making the rich poorer.The only change we'll see will be what's left in your pocket after this clown and his yes men are done.

 

[Traveler 45C]

I don’t think Karl meant that the providers could not provide discounts if they wanted to. His objection was to unfair pricing and cost shifting.

 

[DLCameron2]

The health care system isn't broken as the idiot OBAMA and his group of brain dead cronies indicate. Let the market determine the fix. No price lists are required.

DC

 

[Trojan]

I would think that most current procedures through out the health system are the same or close now days. My insurance payed 100 % of my bill. But on top of this the doctor wanted me to pay extra above the bill. Just because I have insurance he wanted some extra money out of my pocket. I think all procedures should have a fixed price with some flex. I also think that there should be some sort of fund from the government that subsides the hospitals for new equipment. This might stop some of the charges that the hospitals add on for new equipment.

BILL

 

[Boatsb]

Why subsidize the equipment? If it is used regularly it should pay for itself. Just like any other equipment that is amortized over it's useful life. Simply put the cost of an MRI should be based on the average cost of the equipment multiplied by a factor that makes it profitable after a reasonable number of paid users. Just like a rental car. When it has served its purpose and needs to be upgraded or replaced the company makes a financial commitment to getting a new one in it's place and working it. Why is this so foriegn for so many?


There is nothing wrong with a volume or cash discount but the amount needs to be reasonable. It should not cost an individual 5 X as much as an insurance company. Now if that individual is not insured by choice they should not be entitled to the procedure unless they reach an agreement with the service provider.

I would love a new Bentley. I did not save one dollar and my income is under $20K a year so I can not afford one on my own but can't the government get me one because I want one. If the government buys enough Bentleys they should be under $10K right? Just like free health care I should get a free Bentley because the rich guys have them.


We have people coming to the hospitals in Orlando from other areas for free health care. Women without jobs or insurance having kids getting here on a bus if necessary and taking away from the finite resources that the hospitals have to offer. Why do they not go to the hospitals near their homes? Probably because they have taken all the local ones for a ride before with no intention of paying back plus the hospitals here will take them in and give them services for free. That means there is less available resources for the people in the community I support. My son was 3 days old and septic because the hospital screwed up. The doctor ordered him isolated in a room by himself but the administrator put him in a room with another child to get an indigent patient from another area transferred because the other hospital would not provide free health care. Needless to say I opened my mouth as my son was being put in danger for no reason and I was almost arrested.

 

[thoward]

The problem is health insurance not health care.

100% health insurance coverage is crazy as auto insurance that covers oil changes! No wonder it is so expensive. To top it off employers and HSAs take out the sting to consumers. If people have to pay the majority of their basic health care out of their pockets it will bring prices down and end fraud.

Krush, you will not see house calls again. Standard of practice is too extensive.

 

[Boatsb]

The problem is health insurance not health care.

100% health insurance coverage is crazy as auto insurance that covers oil changes! No wonder it is so expensive. To top it off employers and HSAs take out the sting to consumers. If people have to pay the majority of their basic health care out of their pockets it will bring prices down and end fraud.

Krush, you will not see house calls again. Standard of practice is too extensive.

Come on. I saw Royal Pains. They can bring an MRI to your house if you have enough cash.

Tod you have a good point. If I paid for the basic Dr Visits and well care out of my pocket the cost of the insurance would probably be a lot less. That said though how many people would wait until it was an emergency and go to the hospital instead of shelling out $50 for a Dr.

 

[Jaxfishgyd]

I remember Dr. Reynolds coming to my house when I was a kid and treating me....

Course,that was back in the 50's...

That's back when people who could work DID..

The young folks today want everything handed to them....

 

[Brian Degulis]

I would think that most current procedures through out the health system are the same or close now days. My insurance payed 100 % of my bill. But on top of this the doctor wanted me to pay extra above the bill. Just because I have insurance he wanted some extra money out of my pocket. I think all procedures should have a fixed price with some flex. I also think that there should be some sort of fund from the government that subsides the hospitals for new equipment. This might stop some of the charges that the hospitals add on for new equipment.

BILL

Yeah great idea this would stop hospitals from charging the people that actually use the service and transfer that expense to the taxpayers. Hey I've got an idea why don't we just stop charging everone for everything and have government pay for it all. That would eliminate any confusion as to what's paid for and what's not!!!!


Brian

 

[Sparky1]

Hey, I remember our doctor making housecalls in the mid-sixties. Even then you could pretty much figure on getting a shot for something.

As for this topic, it just amazes me that anyone wants to see government get involved in health care. Seriously, name one thing that the government does better in any field compared to private industry. The only thing that comes to mind is fighting a war. Even with that, I'd bet if it were hired out, we'd win more wars and spend less doing it.

Short of that, if the concept of personal responsibility is not put back into the minds of our young people, this country will be doomed to socialism as it won't be able to function any other way. Maybe that's the plan all along.

 

[rrrestorer]

tHE GOVERNMENT IS THE BEST AT...............EMPLOYING MORE PEOPLE TO DO A JOB(OR NOT DO IT) THAN ANY PRIVATE COMPANT,

 

[Trojan]

I pay for all my doctor visits. With 6 people it gets costly. But that does not prevent them from getting sick. I think hospitals should have the latest and greatest equipment as it becomes available. If it wasn't available for Me I don't think I would be here today.They gave me a less than a 50% chance. My best friend died last year because he did not have insurance at the time he was seen at the hospital and they would not give him the proper test or treatments he needed. The hospital is now being sued by his family.
Do you really think people getting minimum wages in this economy can afford health insurance let alone office calls. I have 6 family members with children that can't find work and have no insurance. Who is going to help them when they get ill. The same hospital that treated my best friend. Something needs to change. Free trade SUCKS it won't work in the USA. The housing issue didn't cause the recession it was FREE TRADE. The recession will not be over until our pay is the same as the countries we trade with. Our congress is blind. I don't see any pay cuts in Washington. Wake up America. If you want to see the country in 6 to 10 years just look at South America. There rich and there are dirt poor no in between. Reagan and Clinton were our worst presidents.

BILL

 

[Boatsb]

It's terrible that so many cant' make enough to afford insurance but the cost is getting higher as the few pay for the many. It can't continue because too many people are taking the chance that they will not get sick or someone else will foot the bill if they do.

3 people in a family plan with each one having a $2k deductible $6K total) paying before employer contributions $1,350 a month. So far we have met about $4,500 of the 6K out of pocket. That's about $20K spent on health care not including medications. No wonder I always feel I am paying more than my share.

In a year when no one gets sick or hurt I will pay about the same and each of us sees a Dr. twice for well care. In the last 10 years we only had one serious illness and each year we pay more to get less.

I agree Nobama wants our country like a 3rd world country and is doing everything he can to make that happen.

 

[labrador]

Trojan, you own a Hatteras and don't have health insurance? Something tells me that priority's are wrong here!