36 Volt In Place Of 32V?

[Trojan]

I don't say its the best way to do it and I would not. I only say that it could be done without major changes. The reason for the higher voltage to begin with is less current draw and less of a voltage drop over the wire run distance. Wiring would not need be changed. Like Sky said there are some things that would not tolerate the over voltage and would need to be addressed. It's not a change for the average guy to under take. Your better off staying with the 32volt system.



BILL

 

[doc g]

Smart chargers are available for 32V from Professional Mariner. They are small and light and work great and have a nice warrantee...........Pat

 

[Brian Degulis]

Smart chargers are available for 32V from Professional Mariner. They are small and light and work great and have a nice warrantee...........Pat


The largest I could find on their website was 18 Amp. Is that the biggest 32V they make or did I mis it?

Brian

 

[SKYCHENEY]

Here's the link to the charger I have:
http://www.majorpower.com/chargers/majorbca1000_specs.pdf

The only difference I see is that mine has a digital ref led readout instead of the analog needles. It seems to work fine. I add water about twice per year.

 

[Brian Degulis]

OK you folks have convinced me this is not a good idea to many problems and un knowns.

Thanks for your input it was all logical thought from people that understand the problem including two replies with first hand experience.

Where else could you possably get this kind of information at the push of button?

I'm going to stay with 32V I may use 2 12V and one 8V to build the banks but I'm still looking into that. I think I will go with one of the Outback charger/inverter combinations. It would be nice to not have to run the generator when I just need a little AC power.

Thanks Again
Brian

 

[Pascal]

i use 8v golf cart batteries for my two main banks... about $320 for a set of four, delivered. that's plenty to crank 8V71s... Charger is a promariner, older, but with timer to cut down water usage.

i added a 12v inverter with 8 six volts Golf cart batteries, which is also used to run a few 12v circuits (eletronics, oil changer, ...)

i don't see what the big deal is with 32v system, besides maybe not being able to find all the stuff at the local WM. it works, why reinvent the wheel ?

 

[Boatsb]

I don't think mixing batteries is a good idea. Baisc electrical formulae are based on adding same voltages not dissimilar ones. 2 x 12 plus an 8 would have an issue of balance and I don't understand the need to reinvent the wheel if the 4 x 8v are available. They are $155 each for the big starting batteries but thats not a lot of money compared to electronics, engine repairs or even good fishing equipment.

 

[q240z]

Since none of the currently available smart or dumb 32v chargers have an equilization function, which can dramatically extend battery life, has anybody installed a stand-alone equalizer? I've seen one somewhere online for people who live off the grid. It was around $150, I think.

 

[Brian Degulis]

I agree the 32V systems works great much better than 12V the only problem is that it's a thing of the past an odball. If at all possable or practical I like to get away from odball hard to find expensive stuff. The 8V batteries in my boat are the largest available the best price I got was $238 ea. If I can replace 6 of them with 4 12V 8D I will save $752 and at least partialy get rid of some expensive odball. But again I'm still looking into it one of our members tells me he has been set up like that for many years? The AH of the 12V is very close to the 8V.

I should also mention that my price on the 12V 8D is especialy good as we buy them by the pallet at work.

Brian

 

[Pascal]

so to save a few bucks on batteries every 4 years, you're going to have to deal with a bunch of issues and probalby spend more fixing and troubleshooting ?

i don't know what engines you have but four 8v golf cart batteries works great with 8V71Ns and again, cost only $320 per bank, delivered. last batch lasted about 5 years, not bad in so florida with a dumb charger.

i'm not sure 32V is a thing of the past... it makes a LOT of sense on a larger boats where wire runs are longer. almost everything is available... ex most WM stock rule 2000 32v pumps... and some bulbs. not all, but some.

chargers and inverter maybe a little harder to find but can be ordered from a number of places...

i really dont' know what the big deal is !

 

[thoward]

OK you folks have convinced me this is not a good idea to many problems and un knowns.

Thanks for your input it was all logical thought from people that understand the problem including two replies with first hand experience.

Where else could you possably get this kind of information at the push of button?

I'm going to stay with 32V I may use 2 12V and one 8V to build the banks but I'm still looking into that. I think I will go with one of the Outback charger/inverter combinations. It would be nice to not have to run the generator when I just need a little AC power.

Thanks Again
Brian

How are your battery boxes set up? If you end up replacing the battery boxes it will cost you more than it is to buy the right battery. With a 61' boat I can not see where you could use an inverter. I have a 60c and with 2 fridges, 2 freezers and an ice maker we could not operate off an inverter for very long. This does not add in the 5 A/C units which are a must in Fla. 9-10 months a year. Those 12v71 hold lot and lots of heat!

 

[MikeP]

Yep - Outback 3232 inverter (superb unit), 32v bulbs are all available from Atlantic, the 32v bilge pumps are readily available on the internet. I paid around 80 bucks each for 2000GPH Rule 32v pumps last summer. I can't recall where I bought them - that data's on my NY computer. All the oem 32V motors/pumps and such on the Hatt are rebuildable - they don't have to be replaced when they fail. Most anything you'd replace them with is throw-away (plastic) junk anyway.

REALLY, anything you need in 32v is available - just not at the local store. But other than batteries (3-12volters) there's nothing available locally in 36v either.

As far as the system being an oddball - I don't see any 36v systems being offered today either. On boats under 100ft they all seem to be 24v; longer boats often have 48v. True, those systems can use multiple 12v batts which is an advantage if you wan't to put in cheap batteries. But good 12v traction (deep cycle) batteries are just as expensive as good 8v traction batteries. 8v Batts are commonly available and are extensvely used in industrial and in solar power setups in remote areas.

incidentally Surrette has a REALLY nice 8V with a 10 yr warranty and a 15 year life cycle with enough amperage to run Chicago! The downside is that it weighs 425lbs wet and costs over $1k! Let's see, we'll need 8 of them suckers...

 

[Boatsb]

Brian where are you located? $230+ for a battery is high in my world. $160 is about right. getting the right batteries for a 60 foot boat with my guess 12 cylynder engines should be important. I,m in Orlando but I may be able to help you with the batteries. Zap me a PM or an email scottb@digitalvideosystems.net

 

[Brian Degulis]

I've given up on the 36V idea I'm talking about 2 12V and one 8V to make a 32V bank

Battery boxes will work

As far as the inverter goes

We usually travel from marina to marina so I'm only needing it when I'm runninig and my alternators are 1900 wats each. We don't anchor that much so I would expect to use the generator then.
In the winter I can easily get by with just the refridgerator and a few other small AC loads even in the spring and fall on a long run outside I don't need to run Air Conditioning. So for all those times an inverter will be great all my past boats had them and it works for me. Besides I need a charger anyway so not much more money to ad the inverter capability. And not much of an instalation challenge.

Brian

 

[SKYCHENEY]

Since none of the currently available smart or dumb 32v chargers have an equilization function, which can dramatically extend battery life, has anybody installed a stand-alone equalizer? I've seen one somewhere online for people who live off the grid. It was around $150, I think.

Not true. Look at the Major Power 32v chargers. I posted a link to the pdf of the one I have earlier in this thread. Equalization is available.

 

[Pascal]

Re inverter, i'm not sure i agree that it's of minimal use on a 60 or 61 footer .

i guess it depends on how you use the boat and how it is set up. heck, it's only 8 foot more fiberglass compared to the 53 (yeah, LOA-envy is making me say that)

i guess while you're running, it doens' matter if you have a genset running or not, you won't hear it over the mains but if you anchor out a lot, fresh air and silence are part of what's boating is all about, at least to me.

while a MY has a lot of opening windows compared to a SF, even in summer when anchored i like to keep the windows open and the AC off. that's when an inverter pays off... At night, we really need AC from may to october depending on the year... this year we overnighted with a fan into late may and it was fine. again, it depends of you tolerance and how much you enjoy a quiet boat... heck, i'm starting to sound like a bloboater ! but i like the sound of water against the hull

like everything else, it's something to consider and there are no black or white answer. it depends on theboat and how you use it.

 

[thoward]

We only have 2 window sliders and the engines heat up the saloon a little more than I like. You really can not hear our generators unless you are in the engine room. Mostly you here the water splashing out back. In summer time the interior of the boat gets over 110* without the A/C.

 

[MikeP]

I agree with Pascal.

Initially I thought an inverter was a waste of money. When we purchased it in 2004, our boat had the oem (or dealer-added, I don't know which) 1500w inverter that was extremely inefficient and used a ton of battery power. I didn't use it at all except to check it occasionally. The previous owner had labled the inverter switch, "DO NOT TURN ON." because of the battery drain. One day I checked it and it quit working anyway.

I didn't worry about it much but after a few months of fairly heavy boat use - where we'd start the genny at the beginning of a trip and shut it off a week later when we got back home - I decided that I would like to NOT run the genny for everything. So after much searching and discussion on this site, (thanks again, Sky) I bought an Outback 3232 (32V, 3200W).

It's one of the best things I have on the boat - It cuts the need for the genny running by at least 2/3 thereby reducing fuel use and genny wear. We don't normally run the A/C while the boat is moving which means the genny was operating much of the time just to run the fridge and a few 110V items (microwave, TV, stereo, hair dryer, etc,). In the evening we run the genny for a bit to ensure the water stays hot and to use the stove. At night if A/C is needed then, of course, the Genny stays on but often a fan is sufficient.

I have our inverter set up to operate the fridge, microwave, TVs, stereo and a couple of wall outlets. I don't have it wired to automatically pick up the 120VAC load whenever the shore power or genny aren't supplying power. THe particular circuits are energized by a switch operating a relay which switches those circuits to/from the inverter. I also switch on the inverter manually. Both switches (circuit switchover and inverter power) are mounted in the circuit box panel at the top of the galley steps below the window.

I don't want to make it sound like I work at NOT using the genny. That's not true - I don't like being uncomfortable and if we want the a/c on all day/night then the genny is on for the duration. I DON'T accept discomfort to save fuel/wear. If we wanted to do that we'd own a sailboat. But the inverter/genny combination definitely allows you to have your cake and eat it too!

So to us, a genny and a good inverter are a must!

 

[Brian Degulis]

Ok some updates

I have purchased one of the Outback Power Inverter/chargers the question was raised earlier as to weather or not it has an equalization. It does along with programable charge rates in all stages of charge. For all the info on these units go to outbackpower.com then documents you can dowload everything. The 3200 watt unit cost me $1600 and then $168 for the remote control.

Earlier I asked about building a 32V bank with 2 12V and 1 8V here is what I have learned.

In each individual bank or in multiple banks conected together weather in series or parallel all batteries should have identical cell size, constuction and function. (in other words all batteries should be exactly the same). Any variation in cell size will cause the smaller cells to overcharge and or the larger cells to under charge. Mis matched batteries will function but how well or for how long depends on just how mis matched they are.

Because batteries only last so long under ideal conditions I have decided that the money I would save (about $800) just isn't worth guessing so I'll spend the dough. I have the monster 8 V @ 160lbs ea and around $260ea I don't want to do this twice.

I'm thinking about conecting both banks together to increase my inverter capacity. The problem with doing this is that I then woul have the potential to drain every battery on the boat. To remedy that I was thinking about giving one generator it's own seperate battery bank so I could always start it and get the charger going. I could do that using the less expensive golf cart batteries. But I will need to keep them charged if I use an isolator to do that will I still have the mis match issue to deal with? The isolater creates a voltage drop does anyone know of combiner or intergrator available for 32V?

Thank again for your input it's been a big help

Brian

 

[SKYCHENEY]

Brian,
Instead of adding a new bank, my suggestion would be to add to the house bank(port side on my boat) and then you still have the start bank in reserve to start either the generator or the engines(stbd bank on my boat). You may actually be able to save some money doing this too. Buy 4 regular 8v195's for the start bank and then buy as many 8v golf cart batts as you think you need for the inverter/house bank (I recommend the Trojan 8v golf cart for that). You can get a couple of different amp/hr ratings on those, so you will have to decide how much capacity you need and then buy either 4 or 8 of them.