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1982 55c "Old School"

  • Thread starter Thread starter Paul45c
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My point was not that no body checked. On the big dollar boats it's usually not the owner as they hired a captain/engineer for that purpose.

very few owners of 7 figure boats go bilge diving themselves.
 
very few owners of 7 figure boats go bilge diving themselves.

I need to have some shirts made up that say "Bilge Diver". Seems that's where I spend lots of my time lately!
 
I need to have some shirts made up that say "Bilge Diver". Seems that's where I spend lots of my time lately!

I've got the shirt, I just need the 7 figures.
 
I'm in the ER before, during and after every run. My wife always makes sure I come right back when I tell her her I'm going to the head. She knows I'll be doing an ER check and she doesn't like to take the helm for too long. Then again I don't own a million dollar boat. It was once, but not when I owned it.

I'm kind of in the same position. She's comfortable in open waters and the bay - but if we're in the ditch - she doesn't want me down there too long. I can check temps, drips, pressures, etc. in about 3 minutes. We also put a camera in the ER, with the monitor in the pilothouse (cameras also in the pilothouse, forward and aft). I can hit the head before coming back to the helm - but it has to be the day head beside the pilothouse (one of the BEST features of the 58 LRC!).

I check the ER religiously every 2 hours when cruising. Also do all pre-flight and post-flight checks.
 
I say you have some rare friends ;)
I find most fit Scott billing 150k boats and it every once and a while they do checks!
It is usually after I give them a hard time over it!


Paul Good luck I think :confused:

I can't imagine leaving a dock, or anchorage, or being underway for that matter, without doing a full set of checks on a set timing basis. Working all valves/cocks through their full range (obviously not when systems are running) to keep them operating smoothly, checking bilges and spaces etc. etc.

It's no big deal to do but can keep you on your toes and can identify most potential problems when small rather than when they will turn nasty.

Probably comes from being ex-navy and having regular "engineering rounds" become a part of my habits.

I remember one of my old instructors saying "If you don't actually know that it's working right, then you have to expect that it's not."

It doesn't make any difference what size or what price the vessel is. If it goes wrong when you are at sea your problems are all the greater.
 
You know, none of you are making this any easier!!

Ok, I think you guys need to hear a little more rationale. First off, Dan, you're 100% right -- I've got to be crazy! But then again, all of us are at least a little bit -- nobody could ever cost-justify any one of our boats, though Lord we try.

I had a pretty pristine 45c that I worked up to almost as good as the condition of this one. And at that time my family (3 kids, wife, dog) cruised a few times a year, always with at least 3 or 4 extra. Do the math, and bear in mind 2 of my kids are girls...one head?! I was running that 45c like it was a 70'MY. Then gas prices peaked -- remember $4.40 road gas? I always loved trolling around YachtWorld, and I saw prices coming down, down, down on anything over 45-50' in the Hatt world. The bigger thirstier Hatts were really taking it on the chin. So the "why not?" rationale was really kicking in for me. I pretty much even traded my excellent-condition 45c for the 55c that was, ahem, in NOT so stellar a condition. Actually, I'm selling the Old School of old a little short; she wasn't that bad. Still one of the nicest features of her was the interior, and I didn't have to do too much in the refit. The wiring was downright dangerous, that's no lie, and the paint was getting tired but not necessarily at the repaint stage right away.

Anyway, I had two big assumptions going that led me to make that swap: 1) the family would continue to cruise like we had, pretty much, and 2) diesel would settle from it's highs close to $5/gal down to a lot less. Both assumptions didn't pan out. My girls are in college now, and the breaks just aren't synchronizing well enough to put together the same boat vacations we used to do. We're only doing one small trip a year, now, and I don't really see that changing.

Diesel costs sure didn't drop much. This very boat just a year or two before would have cost me close to double what it did...that's how much that last big fuel price shock rattled the industry. And look where we are now. Still frustratingly hovering on the high side of $3.60 or so. With worldwide demand at unrealistically low levels because of the lousy economy. What do you suppose will start happening to prices once industry starts really cranking again? It peaked just below $5/gal last time, so I have no problems seeing it going over $6.50 or so with decent demand. $5 devastated the market, so what will $6.50 do if I'm right? I told my wife a boat like this could either literally become almost totally unsaleable, or it could lose $100k in value in a heartbeat. Gotta be honest, guys, that's a big hit for what's primarily my big indulgence. I'd have a hard time living with the whole family suffering that hit for daddy to have his big toy floating out back.

I can afford to keep this thing come hell or high water, and even ridiculous fuel prices won't really change my behaviors with whether I decide to go on a trip or not. That's also mitigated by the fact that this vessel is stabilized, and cruises very comfortably at displacement speeds. I'm very lucky that way, but that's not really the issue. It comes down to what I need for what is 95% just local fishing, diving and cocktail cruising. And if we downsize her to a much smaller express or some such, I can fit into the canal where we keep a cottage in the Keys. I could see doing that at least 3 or 4x a year. That would be pretty cool and the wife would be ecstatic since that's her favorite place in the whole world; she gets her beach, and I get the boat for running around down there.

At the end of the day, though, that scenario only makes sense if I get any kind of reasonable offer on Old School. I have no interest in selling this one only to come closer to even trading for a much lesser boat, Keys option or no. I'll just keep it and plan on having it for a long long time.

Firstly Happy Thanksgiving to you all!!!

Now I don't mean to be morbid, however, your long post above says to me you are doing what I do each time I have a bad week/month or year in my business and money is tight or I lose the contract I was SURE I had in the bank!
Then I take a moment to think it through and realise many reasons why I ALWAYS am either a boat owner, on a boat or a buyer: it is the one and ONLY thing that brings me that special feeling that it's been worth it!
I am 54. Worked since I was 17. Worried, fought and fell on my ass many times before I had some success!
AND I AM CERTAIN MOST ON THIS FORUM ARE THE SAME.

Today I am going to the funeral of my electrician. He was found floating in a pool while changing the low voltage lights. We don't know what killed him, heart or electrocution. He was 48, I have known him for 20 years and he was a GREAT guy.
It is the FOURTH funeral I will be at in 2 years!
Only one was for a person who lived a long and fruitful life. The rest were people under 56 years old!
We don't talk about it amongst our small group of friends, but one was a suicide brought about by the economy.
Yeah, things are real tough where I do my business, same as in Florida, but nothing lasts. Good or Bad.
I have been seriously thinking of selling my Hatteras, just when I have learnt (with some help from you guys) to fix and maintain the things a paid mechanic used to do for me, and I ENJOY doing this maintenance and learnt a lot with my sons too.
Last week my eldest son and I went far out to the shelf, about 150 fathoms and 5 hours out. Caught Mahi Mahi, yellowfin and had a strike from a Blue Marlin. I haven't enjoyed or relaxed like that for 6 months!
Paul, take it of the market mate and go fishing with your friends!
 
Thanks, Jasper, for the kind advice. I appreciate the concern, but truly, I'm one of the lucky ones that doesn't have to sell the boat to pay bills or get out from under a brutal loan or anything. No, for once with my boating addiction I'm actually trying to look ahead and reasonably evaluate my boating needs matched up against what I see going on in the market and decided to take a kind of pre-emptive move.

With kids scattering to college and elsewhere, I'm just not cruising the way I was with the huge boatload, whereas I certainly used to. My poor old 45c (previous boat) always was going with a minimum of 8! So, when the market cratered the last time fuel got really expensive, I looked at stepping up to the 55c with a "why not?" attitude. I think I bought it for close to half of what it would have cost me just a year prior.

Now, with a lot emptier boat and my last remaining chick in the nest not being a real dyed-in-the-wool boater (and the admiral certainly not being one, either, at least as far as big bluewater trips go), I can be happier with a lot less. I fish and dive locally, mostly, along with occasional trips down to the Keys, and all that points to a lesser boat that can actually free me up more to be on the water more.

But, being totally forthright, the thing that nagged at me to the point of listing the boat was the thought that fuel prices will force another big cratering of the market, and this one will be much larger and longer-lasting (probably permanent) than the last time road gasoline got over $4.40/gal around here. In that scenario, I figured the boat would instantly lose in excess of $100k, or maybe just become totally unmarketable. I'm talking the land of $6.50/gal diesel, and that's not so hard to conceive of.

It's a given that we all invest significant time and treasure in our Hatt obsessions, and love every minute and penny of it. But I had to look in the mirror and ask myself if I was good with the whole family's checkbook taking that kind of hit just to satisfy my all-consuming hobby when I could be quite content with something a lot less risky in terms of market downturns. You see my answer.

She's going to close in about a week, and I'll miss her, but I also feel like I took a pretty prudent measure for now.
 
Thanks, Jasper, for the kind advice. I appreciate the concern, but truly, I'm one of the lucky ones that doesn't have to sell the boat to pay bills or get out from under a brutal loan or anything. No, for once with my boating addiction I'm actually trying to look ahead and reasonably evaluate my boating needs matched up against what I see going on in the market and decided to take a kind of pre-emptive move.

With kids scattering to college and elsewhere, I'm just not cruising the way I was with the huge boatload, whereas I certainly used to. My poor old 45c (previous boat) always was going with a minimum of 8! So, when the market cratered the last time fuel got really expensive, I looked at stepping up to the 55c with a "why not?" attitude. I think I bought it for close to half of what it would have cost me just a year prior.

Now, with a lot emptier boat and my last remaining chick in the nest not being a real dyed-in-the-wool boater (and the admiral certainly not being one, either, at least as far as big bluewater trips go), I can be happier with a lot less. I fish and dive locally, mostly, along with occasional trips down to the Keys, and all that points to a lesser boat that can actually free me up more to be on the water more.

But, being totally forthright, the thing that nagged at me to the point of listing the boat was the thought that fuel prices will force another big cratering of the market, and this one will be much larger and longer-lasting (probably permanent) than the last time road gasoline got over $4.40/gal around here. In that scenario, I figured the boat would instantly lose in excess of $100k, or maybe just become totally unmarketable. I'm talking the land of $6.50/gal diesel, and that's not so hard to conceive of.

It's a given that we all invest significant time and treasure in our Hatt obsessions, and love every minute and penny of it. But I had to look in the mirror and ask myself if I was good with the whole family's checkbook taking that kind of hit just to satisfy my all-consuming hobby when I could be quite content with something a lot less risky in terms of market downturns. You see my answer.

She's going to close in about a week, and I'll miss her, but I also feel like I took a pretty prudent measure for now.

You made a point which scares the heck out of me to go on looking for another hat the word nonmarkatable has showed up for the first time got me thinking a lot. Do i need to spend 200 to 300 thousand and another 10 to 15 k in a selfish way just to satisfy my desire. That 6.50 per gallon scares the hell out of me . Tim
 
Well good luck Paul!
BTW last time I fueled up I paid the equivalent of US$5.90 per gallon!
It does make me tear up a bit I must admit, but I also don't do much high speed cruising. About 10 to 12 knots and then trolling speeds.
We have some good blue marlin and Mahi Mahi out far so I check the weather and make a long day of it with my sons. Wish I had two generators though, I only have a 20 kw Onan and that is expensive to run.

Hell I remember when I was paying almost HALF this and it still was a LOT!

I have a chuckle when I hear about guys buying 1500 hp engines for a 40 knot run. In our seas it would break your teeth and the bank balance!
Cheers,
George
 
If the economy recovers enough for US diesel prices to reach $6.50/gallon I think we'll all be happy with the profits we're generating in our businesses! I don't see that happening in the next five years. Housing won't recover until at least 2013 or 2014 and that drives a huge piece of the economy.

That said, our boats will continue to depreciate, although I don't think the rapid decline we saw from 2008-2011 will continue. I think you'll see normal declines - instead of fire sale prices over the next couple of years as inventory levels are absorbed ny new/upgrading buyers.

The more challenging issue for boaters and the boating community is the socio-economic effects related to the time commitments involved with this hobby/sport. In a nutshell, people are being pulled in many different directions (family, work, etc.) and simply don't have as much free time available as they did only 5 years ago. The golfing industry is suffering from a similar phenomena. Unfortunately, this shift will probably not change in our generation.

Personally, I'm making a dedicated effort to combat this trend by spending more time on the boat and with the family. Certainly it means that my business probably doesn't generate the revenue/profits that it potentially could, but I've decided to "live for today" a little more than in prior years. True, my kids will probably hate that their nest egg doesn't have another decimel place but they've been around long enough to see the family's strong work ethic and will do just fine.
 
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If the economy recovers enough for US diesel prices to reach $6.50/gallon I think we'll all be happy with the profits we're generating in our businesses! I don't see that happening in the next five years. Housing won't recover until at least 2013 or 2014 and that drives a huge piece of the economy.

That said, our boats will continue to depreciate, although I don't think the rapid decline we saw from 2008-2011 will continue. I think you'll see normal declines - instead of fire sale prices over the next couple of years as inventory levels are absorbed ny new/upgrading buyers.

The more challenging issue for boaters and the boating community is the socio-economic effects related to the time commitments involved with this hobby/sport. In a nutshell, people are being pulled in many different directions (family, work, etc.) and simply don't have as much free time available as they did only 5 years ago. The golfing industry is suffering from a similar phenomena. Unfortunately, this shift will probably not change in our generation.

Personally, I'm making a dedicated effort to combat this trend by spending more time on the boat and with the family. Certainly it means that my business probably doesn't generate the revenue/profits that it potentially could, but I've decided to "live for today" a little more than in prior years. True, my kids will probably hate that their nest egg doesn't have another decimel place but they've been around long enough to see the family's strong work ethic and will do just fine.

JEFF
i SEE YOU ARE THE PROUD OWNER OF A LRC! Would you share some of the fuel burn numbers? As much as i do not want to give up the convertable (sport fishing ) i in a worst way do not want to give up boating. My wife is not by any means a lover of boating, She goes because i push. Our nest is clean and our one child lives on the coast about 500 miles by boat away. I belive i could make the trip to her location and if that was the destination i could always have a first mate. I would be on the watter with a satisfied wife and maybee a moderate fuel burn. Scratching the boating itch. Tim
 
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If the economy recovers enough for US diesel prices to reach $6.50/gallon I think we'll all be happy with the profits we're generating in our businesses! I don't see that happening in the next five years. Housing won't recover until at least 2013 or 2014 and that drives a huge piece of the economy.

That said, our boats will continue to depreciate, although I don't think the rapid decline we saw from 2008-2011 will continue. I think you'll see normal declines - instead of fire sale prices over the next couple of years as inventory levels are absorbed ny new/upgrading buyers.

The more challenging issue for boaters and the boating community is the socio-economic effects related to the time commitments involved with this hobby/sport. In a nutshell, people are being pulled in many different directions (family, work, etc.) and simply don't have as much free time available as they did only 5 years ago. The golfing industry is suffering from a similar phenomena. Unfortunately, this shift will probably not change in our generation.

Personally, I'm making a dedicated effort to combat this trend by spending more time on the boat and with the family. Certainly it means that my business probably doesn't generate the revenue/profits that it potentially could, but I've decided to "live for today" a little more than in prior years. True, my kids will probably hate that their nest egg doesn't have another decimel place but they've been around long enough to see the family's strong work ethic and will do just fine.

Well said!
Fact is, each generation will only rise to the challenges it/they have to or need to challenge.
Every character has a hero in them, depending on the circumstance.
Back to boating…I should not delve into the above to deeply!

We EARNED this reward.
Let us enjoy it and SHARE it!!
 
JEFF
i SEE YOU ARE THE PROUD OWNER OF A LRC! Would you share some of the fuel burn numbers?

Tim, I'm happy to share burn numbers. In a nutshell, my numbers are pretty simple:

Twin 4-71's burn a combined 8gph at about 8 knots (1,400-1,500 rpms). "Reducing" speed to 6 knots, we're burning about 6gph. Our 20kw Koehler's burn about 1gph each, but we only run one at a time. So basically I calculate that I burn about 10 gallons per hour - when in reality it's a little less.

Moving from a convertible to a LRC will be quite a speed shock. I would highly recommend that you spend some time on one. 8 knots is very slow. While we love this lifestyle/speed, cruising days must be planned more carefully (getting from Point A to Point B). It's not as simple as pushing the throttles a little further and getting their faster, cause it just won't happen.

The positives:
- Tons of storage/space
- Small cockpit for fishing (I've been rockfishing the past few weekends with friends)
- Great fuel economy
- Small NA Engines are easy to work on and non-electronic (run forever!)
- Deep safe displacement hull that comfortable in most any condition

Negatives:
- Slow speed
 
JEFF
i SEE YOU ARE THE PROUD OWNER OF A LRC! Would you share some of the fuel burn numbers? As much as i do not want to give up the convertable (sport fishing ) i in a worst way do not want to give up boating. My wife is not by any means a lover of boating, She goes because i push. Our nest is clean and our one child lives on the coast about 500 miles by boat away. I belive i could make the trip to her location and if that was the destination i could always have a first mate. I would be on the watter with a satisfied wife and maybee a moderate fuel burn. Scratching the boating itch. Tim
You need a SF, it"s too much a part of who you are. The LRC is not going to be much cheaper to run than a 52C running at hull speed. I think I can get close to 1nmpg at 8kts. It does fall off fast once you push the throttles, but I do have the choice to run fast or slow. I tried running 10kts when we brought the boat north, but it's not for me. Once we pushed the throttles forward there was no turning back. I did run her slower than normal (17-17.5kts) but we were still on step.
 
You need a SF, it"s too much a part of who you are. The LRC is not going to be much cheaper to run than a 52C running at hull speed.

I think the biggest difference in operating costs is having to overhaul the engines. There's a huge difference in price here. Plus I think 'majors' occur on a more frequent basis on SF's compared to LRC's. Just the nature of higher rpm's and wear/tear.

That said, I agree with Jack. Recalling the prior posts of yours that I've read - I'd say you will always need a SF.
 
I think the biggest difference in operating costs is having to overhaul the engines. There's a huge difference in price here. Plus I think 'majors' occur on a more frequent basis on SF's compared to LRC's. Just the nature of higher rpm's and wear/tear.

That said, I agree with Jack. Recalling the prior posts of yours that I've read - I'd say you will always need a SF.
It all boils down to fuel. The more you burn the more wear and tear on the engine. My 12V92's will probably burn a similar amount of fuel as your 471's by the time they need majors. The difference is in how many hours it takes me to burn it compared to you. When the time comes to major them, the cost difference will be huge. Speed doesn't come cheap.
 
The grass is always greener!

Tim, if it's any consolation, my yard crew was trying to convince me to put outriggers on my LRC!
While that's not going to happen, we all have a tough time trying to make out current boat the ultimate panacea....
 
The grass is always greener!

Tim, if it's any consolation, my yard crew was trying to convince me to put outriggers on my LRC!
While that's not going to happen, we all have a tough time trying to make out current boat the ultimate panacea....

Jeff

This is as hard as working! Tryimg to figure out what to do. With the election comming and possibely higher fuel cost and less fish to catch and reaching the goldon years what do you do. Fish or just ride i hate to purchase a sport fish onely to see it fade away in value or not be able to use it because of fuel prices. (the way it was intended to be used).
Actually today i looked at a 56 foot Harkers island made boat with one big cat seed at approximately 26k cruise. Fairely finished out well it will fish ok but cruise my wifel would never agree.(watching black and white tv is tuff for her) But fuel burn was grate. I have absolutely talked my self into not eaven going back to that one.
I have come to one conclusion i shoud have kept my 45c it was to go to let go. HOW CRAZY I WAS THINKING i needed a bigger boat. Tim
 
Tim, I'm happy to share burn numbers. In a nutshell, my numbers are pretty simple:

Twin 4-71's burn a combined 8gph at about 8 knots (1,400-1,500 rpms). "Reducing" speed to 6 knots, we're burning about 6gph. Our 20kw Koehler's burn about 1gph each, but we only run one at a time. So basically I calculate that I burn about 10 gallons per hour - when in reality it's a little less.

Moving from a convertible to a LRC will be quite a speed shock. I would highly recommend that you spend some time on one. 8 knots is very slow. While we love this lifestyle/speed, cruising days must be planned more carefully (getting from Point A to Point B). It's not as simple as pushing the throttles a little further and getting their faster, cause it just won't happen.

The positives:
- Tons of storage/space
- Small cockpit for fishing (I've been rockfishing the past few weekends with friends)
- Great fuel economy
- Small NA Engines are easy to work on and non-electronic (run forever!)
- Deep safe displacement hull that comfortable in most any condition

Negatives:
- Slow speed



Jeff
I just can not go that slow it would kill me see Jack pass me

Tim
 
You need a SF, it"s too much a part of who you are. The LRC is not going to be much cheaper to run than a 52C running at hull speed. I think I can get close to 1nmpg at 8kts. It does fall off fast once you push the throttles, but I do have the choice to run fast or slow. I tried running 10kts when we brought the boat north, but it's not for me. Once we pushed the throttles forward there was no turning back. I did run her slower than normal (17-17.5kts) but we were still on step.

You are correct Jack doggett!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If i can not fish i do not need nothing and a SF does fit.Today i looked at a 56 Harkers Island SF. The bank is taking it is not me. Of course it was not finished off indside but still it aint for me. Tim
 

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