What does the future hold for our old Hatts?

[C. Edmund]

boats are not really flippable as projects -- just takes four dollars of work to add a dollar of sales value -- and in a good market it's not much better.

And for the record, things are not booming in the vintage car market either -- possibly an exception on the real upper end.

 

[saltshaker]

I bought my 46C over 11 years ago in a strong market. I have used her, updated her and even repowered with newer bigger used engines. I never bought her with the intention of making money. Boats are a depreciating asset and even when you are lucky enough to sell her for close to what you paid, the cost of ownership can never be recovered. I would prefer my boat was worth more than she really is but the fact of the matter is I didn't expect it to appreciate the way it did over the years. Net net she was still a great buy and I am glad to have had the years of enjoyment that comes with one of these majestic old boats. Remember these are big expensive toys that cost a lot to own, even if someone gave you one for free. I know if I sell her she will bring far less than she is worth to me. Hopefully that sale will only come because I found my next Hatt that is worth letting this one go for. I've always felt a boat should be a cash purchase or at least be bought with a very large down payment. You have to expect the value to decline and if you borrow 70% or more of the purchase price, it will be easy to end up with negative equity. I'm sure the brokers here can confirm how common it is for sellers to right a check to the bank at closing. This like the housing market is a long overdue adjustment.

 

[tmusvi]

Who knows what the future holds for these old boats? I'm 44 years old and was looking for a 30-33ft boat 3 years ago. Like someone here posted, many buyers go back and buy something you had your eye on as a kid you could not afford. When I was a kid Hatteras and Bertram were the Cadillac of boats so when I went hunting I went hunting for a Hatteras and Bertram. Well, Lake Erie doesn't have many of either but MAN, did I want a 32 Hatteras express. There was one for sale in Port Clinton. A wreck for $64,000 with tired crusaders. It's now for sale for 45,000 but I honestly don't think it is worth 30. Hopefully someone will buy it and bring it back to its former glory. I ended up with a 31 Tiara that I love, but I still always like looking at old Hatteras's and Bertrams. Who knows --maybe someday. Here I am still lurking on the Hatteras webpage and I don't own one. I have restored 3 boats from the grave in my lifetime. A 1956 23 ft Chris Craft Continental a 1956 26 ft twin engine Chris Craft Continental, and a 1977 Lyman Biscayne. I am still working on the lyman but the Chris crafts are long since sold. I broke even on them by paying myself nothing for the countless hours of work but I'm glad that I did it. It was 3 boats that were going to be burned if not for me and I'm proud that they are still going strong now. I don't want to see them 10 years from now because I'd probably be sick. Much like the previous owner of the 32 Hatteras I saw in Port Clinton.

I have a 32 sportfish in mint condition and love it best hatteras I ever owned, living the dream in the USVI

 

[rob71]

I purchased my 1971 DCMY in 2007 for $118K. The original new price was $119K.
2 previous owners, the latter of which spent $150K over the prior 15 yrs. interior refit, re power etc.
At the time the broker said this will always be a 100K boat. I believe he was pretty close to being right.
Of course I love my Hatt ( living aboard) and have no plans to sell.

 

[Finalee]

My 43 DC has tons of extras. The most significant being stabilizers. I really think $50,000 will be what I end up selling for. The 9 years of fun I had are priceless. In fact, anyone looking for one drop me a pm.

 

[Fanfare]

A few years ago as we waved goodbye to the boat taking our kids and grand kids home from spring break with us, my wife said to me "You know, this might not be the most cost-effective way to do it, but anything that makes our kids and grandchildren want to be with us is not all bad."

At another juncture, I told the Admiral that the good thing of my owning a boat is that it means I can't afford a mistress so she has nothing to worry about. I'm not certain this was that well received.

 

[Mark Lloyd]

The MY versions in particular have a unique value. They are the least expensive, three bedroom, three head, three level waterfront condos in the US. Depending on what state we live in, there is no property tax.

In comparison, a "land condo" waterfront with same layout would cost $500,000 to over $1,000,000 anywhere along the east coast. Dockage varies and we can just leave if we don't like the weather or the neighbors.

I have no plans to sell but if I was I would list it with a good broker and a good realtor.

Just a thought.

Mark

 

[saltshaker]

The MY versions in particular have a unique value. They are the least expensive, three bedroom, three head, three level waterfront condos in the US. Depending on what state we live in, there is no property tax.

In comparison, a "land condo" waterfront with same layout would cost $500,000 to over $1,000,000 anywhere along the east coast. Dockage varies and we can just leave if we don't like the weather or the neighbors.

I have no plans to sell but if I was I would list it with a good broker and a good realtor.

Just a thought.

Mark

Buying is the easy and least expensive part. I think a million dollar condo would cost less and return more at resale than one of these old boats. I know what I spend annually on our boat and its more than that condo would cost annually. Trying to make these great boats into condos is what has left so many of them in poor shape. We use ours as a summer home but also as a boat. We keep her up and run her regularly. She is a boat first by a long shot and then a place to stay in the summer. If I just wanted a house near the beach, that would be a whole lot easier.

 

[sandspur1966]

Just refreshing this thread after looking at some bertrams for a friend. He was about to buy a new whaler for crazy money and I suggested looking for an already refit bertram.

Went online and was floored by the asking prices for refit 20ft moppies. There are about a dozen on YW and the average price is in the 30k range.

Would be interesting to see if they are getting anywhere near these asks. Is it a situation where the number of this particular model boat out there has diminished to the point of where demand is outstripping supply?

As we see more and more of the older Hatts getting past the point where they can feasibly be refurbished, will our survivors ever see a similar phenomenon?

It is snowing up here in NY on the first day of spring and I'm just daydreaming.

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...cyid=100&cit=true&No=0&Ns=PBoat_length_feet|0

 

[piripucha]

I havent seen a NEW boat that makes my heart pound as my OLD Hatteras. Not even a Marlow wich I consider a sensible boat, although for me its has its quirks. If I had the finantial means I would completly rebuild my 58 YF, new paint, modern diesel engines , new air conditioning systems and maybe if I can find the space a gyro stabilezer system. That woul keep me sane for a couple of years. In the mean time I paited the old girl las year. I hope you all like it. As my wife says itlooks like an old lady with a new set of rack. Next comes the face lift and the tommy tuck.

 

[captddis]

It looks great!

 

[johnjen50]

Wow! Beautiful. Did you do the paint yourself? What kind.....Awlgrip, Alexseal? I have a 58 yachtfish as well and agree the lines are a thing of beauty to me. I really like the yellow hull. Nice work!

 

[Pascal]

Looks great in pale yellow!! I Ve been thinking about this for a while and seeing a picture is great.
Now that the sailboat is is bult and Pretty much finished, and that the E-type restoration is wrapping up soon I'm starting to make plans for the Hatt as it finally reaching the top of the list. Hopefully tHt will start this summer.

One thing I will do is re do the galley but not downstairs. I ve pretty much decided to follow the trend of many modern boats that size, as well as catamarans, and move the galley to the aft end of the saloon, opened to the aft deck. I've done some preliminary measuring and drawing and there is plenty of room.

Makes a lot of sense on an owner operated boat that size as the aft deck is where we spend the most time so why not have the galley close to it. Cruising cats started this trend a few years back and many modern 50 footers have followed.

The space currently used by the cave galley and the never used dinette can be used to build a fourth Stateroom like the 58MY but stateroom on port side, head on starboard where the dinette is. Or if not needed then it would replace the mid ship stateroom to expand the master.

 

[Avenger]

Wow, piripucha, on first blink I didn't recognize it as a Hatteras. Looks very nice and updated with the color defining the hull instead of an accent stripe. Of course, having those classic Hatteras lines it will look good either way, but I like what you've done.

Pascal, didn't Hatteras do an aft galley on the original 38C? It didn't seem to sell well, and some say it was the unusual layout. I thought it was a smart idea, but I guess either ahead of it's time or maybe didn't work as well on a convertible.

 

[thoward]

Just refreshing this thread after looking at some bertrams for a friend. He was about to buy a new whaler for crazy money and I suggested looking for an already refit bertram.

Went online and was floored by the asking prices for refit 20ft moppies. There are about a dozen on YW and the average price is in the 30k range.

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...cyid=100&cit=true&No=0&Ns=PBoat_length_feet|0

I am refitting a 25 Blackfin Combi with twin 5.7L inboards. These older boats are a completely different animal than the newer ones. I bought the boat right but will end up with more in it than she is worth. It would not be difficult to put $50K+ in one of these boats. The major issue is you still will not have the speed or space of a new boat with modern outboards.

 

[JakeC]

In Minnesota there are many large old Chris Crafts about to restore, and I have enjoyed owning three through the years.
When a 1966 Hatteras Twin cabin appeared in our Minneapolis boat brokerage listing, well, I just
couldn't resist buying it this January. Hull number 51, originally sold to the grandson of the founder of Andersen Windows. On a shelf in the back bedroom closet were manuals, the original bill of sale, receipts back to the 1960's, a stack about 12 inches tall of paperwork. This Hatteras is a time capsule with the original wallpaper in the bathrooms, bunk mattresses, faucets, refrigerator, stove, carpeting, even the original Decca 101 radar! Propulsion is, you guessed it, the original 426 Chrysler "Golden Commando" big blocks that show good even compression, with 1100 hours.
The only thing I can tell that is sadly missing is a record player that came standard.
Right now its hard to come up with much in the way of photos because shrink wrap darkens the interior. The mechanical systems are being updated, the PO was not well disposed to replace rotten fuel hose, water hose or corroded battery cables.
I sincerely hope this posting is OK in this thread, it's my first on the Hatteras Owners site. Looks like I'm someone who is on the positive balance sheet for the Future of Old Hatteras.

 

[piripucha]

Wow! Beautiful. Did you do the paint yourself? What kind.....Awlgrip, Alexseal? I have a 58 yachtfish as well and agree the lines are a thing of beauty to me. I really like the yellow hull. Nice work!

The hull I had it painted profesionally at a local Yard. The upper part I did it myself with the roll and tip method. I used wllgrip Matherhorn white and the yellow is called San Mateo wheat. Since the boat was gelcoated I had to prime it first.

 

[smoothmove]

In Minnesota there are many large old Chris Crafts about to restore, and I have enjoyed owning three through the years.
When a 1966 Hatteras Twin cabin appeared in our Minneapolis boat brokerage listing, well, I just
couldn't resist buying it this January. Hull number 51, originally sold to the grandson of the founder of Andersen Windows. On a shelf in the back bedroom closet were manuals, the original bill of sale, receipts back to the 1960's, a stack about 12 inches tall of paperwork. This Hatteras is a time capsule with the original wallpaper in the bathrooms, bunk mattresses, faucets, refrigerator, stove, carpeting, even the original Decca 101 radar! Propulsion is, you guessed it, the original 426 Chrysler "Golden Commando" big blocks that show good even compression, with 1100 hours.
The only thing I can tell that is sadly missing is a record player that came standard.
Right now its hard to come up with much in the way of photos because shrink wrap darkens the interior. The mechanical systems are being updated, the PO was not well disposed to replace rotten fuel hose, water hose or corroded battery cables.
I sincerely hope this posting is OK in this thread, it's my first on the Hatteras Owners site. Looks like I'm someone who is on the positive balance sheet for the Future of Old Hatteras.

I remember that boat. A cool 41 as I recall. Looked pretty original. Right down to the fiberglass gas tanks. If you don't know about them, you soon will .... welcome to the world of boating.
Eric

 

[JakeC]

Thanks Eric,
I believe you have hull 53 of the 1966 TC's? The before and after photos that are amazing. Your boat gives me a goal in working on mine. I know ethanol dissolves styrene into the gasoline from fiberglass fuel tanks. The styrene turns to goo when exposed to heat inside the engine, damaging valves and rings. Plus, the tanks start leaking. My marina sells gasoline with no ethanol, as does most of the marinas I know of on the upper Mississippi. The tanks seem to have proper integrity with no fuel smell. The boat has a fume detector as well in the engine room.
Last weekend I finished painting the engines. Now I have to install the new Edelbrock 750 marine carburetors, new 100 amp marine one wire alternators, electronic ignition, Carter marine electric fuel pumps, and massive water fuel separators. Paint the bilge, new carpeting, new mattresses, oh my, what did I get into. The project list runs way long and includes some things I don't even know about yet.
It's really rewarding to take a solid hull that has been neglected since about 1983, and make shipshape all the large and small details. ANY advice from the member forum would be greatly appreciated. I wonder about the water tank built into the keel, that sounds skunky.

 

[smoothmove]

You're probably thinking of the other (better) Eric (Horst). Sounds like you're into the work pretty good. Good for you - enjoy the project. If you have a source for ethanol free gas you can worry about that later, but if the day comes to address this, it's a heavy job, but has been done successfully many times.
I finally gave up on my keel water tank and converted to a smaller polyethylene water tank. The water tank is now a holding tank. And yes I realize this was a one way journey. I now have fresh tasting water and a 140 gallon holding tank. I can't drink that much beer in a whole summer.
I presume you boat on the Mississippi or possibly the St. Croix. That would be pretty awesome.
Eric