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R22 Conversion to M099?

E

Eddieclemons

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 14, 2019
Messages
572
Status
  1. OWNER - I own a Hatteras Yacht
Hatteras Model
52' CONVERTIBLE (1983 - 1990)
While I have many other concerns with my 88 52C that are more pressing, I do have a AC unit that needs service very soon. Since a 10lb bottle of R22 is $600 I am thinking about doing conversions as I start servicing my units. I am hearing about a little loss in efficiently but the M099 is a evacuate and go option. Anyone have any knowledge or real world experience with this conversion?
 
Check eBay I got 10lb for $239
 
Isn't R410A also a direct replacement for R22?
 
SKYCHENEY said:
Isn't R410A also a direct replacement for R22?
Click to expand...

Yes. But you have to buy the new system with it. It requires a much higher pressure to do its job and cannot be retrofitted in older systems.
 
It's the next step in cleaner greener less efficient refrigerant but not a replacement. It uses a different type of oil and different pressures.

at this point I'd not put much time or money into an old system with r22. It's been discontinued for a long time. I believe q0 plus years since the equipment was discontinued. So if you have a system under 10 years old it's probably not r22.
 
If your current unit is losing freon, have you been able to track down the leak? I'd check the service valves and connections - Tighten those before you add any freon, since otherwise you're pouring money into a hole. I pulled the cap off the service valves to check pressures in one of my failing units and it blew all the remaining freon right then. These were the original Crusair units, so they were 30 + years old. Amazing they still ran at all.

You've probably already figured that out - PO of my boat apparently was overcharging units to get thru survey and sale, within 3 months after we lost 2 compressors out of 4, and the leaking unit was already having issues at the air handler end. He rolled the dice and got lucky in this case.

If you hold an EPA freon certification (required to purchase freon), I'd check prices online but also local - Thermo King and Carrier truck and trailer refrigeration dealerships may have somewhat better pricing than more conventional sales locations.

We ended up installing stand-alone units for the galley/V-berth, and master stateroom and midships stateroom. More expensive upfront, but already saving me money on electric and stress.
 
oscarvan said:
Yes. But you have to buy the new system with it. It requires a much higher pressure to do its job and cannot be retrofitted in older systems.
Click to expand...

Really? Because several years ago I bought a new condenser unit from SPCoolin when he was still with us. It was identical to my original 1985 unit, but it had 410 in it. We pulled that out and charged it with R22.

Too bad Steve is gone. He was truly the expert on this stuff.
 
SKYCHENEY said:
Really? Because several years ago I bought a new condenser unit from SPCoolin when he was still with us. It was identical to my original 1985 unit, but it had 410 in it. We pulled that out and charged it with R22.

Too bad Steve is gone. He was truly the expert on this stuff.
Click to expand...

And I am no expert so I would like to believe you as it would buy me (a lot) of time on my units. I was just reporting what the various technical sites were telling me. But you sent me back in the rabbit hole and I found this:

https://legacyac.com/things-to-be-aware-of-when-considering-r-22-replacement-refrigerants/

But also this.... so it appears that MO99/R438-A is a viable option, with some caveats.

https://heatingcooling.fergusonhvac.com/txr/2018/05/10/mo99-an-r-22-retrofit-solution/
 
Last edited:
oscarvan said:
And I am no expert so I would like to believe you as it would buy me (a lot) of time on my units. I was just reporting what the various technical sites were telling me. But you sent me back in the rabbit hole and I found this:

https://legacyac.com/things-to-be-aware-of-when-considering-r-22-replacement-refrigerants/

But also this.... so it appears that MO99/R438-A is a viable option, with some caveats.

https://heatingcooling.fergusonhvac.com/txr/2018/05/10/mo99-an-r-22-retrofit-solution/
Click to expand...

Good for you researching - I was trying to do the same but got derailed with an issue of my own.
 
I notice, nowhere is mentioned R417a. The next replacement for R22 without oil change.
It was common to purchase R417a compressors or condensing stations, reclaim the R417a and charge all with R22.
 
Somethings are amazingly tough. I checked my two OEM Cruisair units this week. In the six years I’ve owned Aslan, I’ve never had issues with them. Thought the fwd cabin unit might need something, but it’s rarely used. It had about 40 psi on suction side, but still putting out 58 degree air. I bumped it up to 55 psi and it’s at 50 F with good head. The other oldie was on 50 psi and cooling well. The charts called for 60 + psi, but no way I’m going that high on a coolish day. Not too bad for 38 year old heat pumps.
 
Just use propane it’s cheap easy to get and you can fins the leaks wit a match
 
R-22 is not that hard to come by, as least locally. I was able to buy a new, in the sealed box, 30 lb cylinder about 1 year ago for just over $300 from a private individual (yah craigslist!). I didn't even have to meet them in an ally behind an old abandoned warehouse or anything. That should be enough for my DIY air conditioner maintenance until my old CruiseAire units turn to rust. :cool:
 
Play'N Hooky Too said:
R-22 is not that hard to come by, as least locally. I was able to buy a new, in the sealed box, 30 lb cylinder about 1 year ago for just over $300 from a private individual (yah craigslist!). I didn't even have to meet them in an ally behind an old abandoned warehouse or anything. That should be enough for my DIY air conditioner maintenance until my old CruiseAire units turn to rust. :cool:
Click to expand...

eBay as well. I'm sitting on a few pounds as well, enough to keep me going.
 
I checked into this when i had some compressors go out. I found it cheaper just to source r22 locally or on ebay. Way cheaper than you quoted.

Someday, once all the other projects are done (yeah right lol) I want to go with a chiller type system, should save considerable space in an already cramped engine/equipment space.
 
I have 7 of the older rotary control ac units. They are R22. We recently had a compressor short to ground. I was able to order a new r22 compressor from PTAC Solutions for about $300.

We charged with R407-c instead of R22. All same hardware and is one of the coldest acs on the boat now. My AC guy just did a compressor swap instead of trying to replace the entire system. The evaps on these old girls seem bullet proof!

We did not try the M99 since our AC guy said the 407 is better formulated for these acs. Super happy and my wallet is happy too!
 
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