Forum categories

[Avenger]

I posted this in the "discussion forums" thread, but nobody seemed to notice so I'll try it again here:

I've been monitoring our forum for quite a while now, and I've read a lot of the archives. I know that when the present forum was created the decision was made by the members not to split the forum into a technical and general forum, and for valid reasons. However, as membership increases the volume of threads is starting to expand pretty rapidly. Also I see many subjects brought up as new threads that have already been covered to death. While I guess we could fault the new members for not doing their homework, the volume of what they have to sift through to find an answer is daunting. Is it time to reconsider splitting up the general discussion forum into technical, social, general or whatever categories?

I realize too that this would require someone to go back and categorize all of the old threads. No easy task, due to volume and the fact that some of the threads wander a bit off topic. We could just call it the archive and start fresh, although I don't think that would serve the purpose. Any thoughts?

P.S. This morning I noted that there were 3,000 threads and we're approaching 30,000 posts.

 

[Genesis]

I don't know if its a good idea to do this... or even if we could reasonably categorize things post-hoc if we did......

 

[Pascal]

when someone is looking for a specific issue, the quickest way will be to search the forums... ex... search for rudder or autopilot or ...

scrolling thru pages and pages isn't the best way to find something. And if you're going to search, it doens't matter what the categories are.

i would guess that most of the regular users check the forum on a daily basis, that's usually about a page worth of threads. you can quickly go thru the thread list and see what you want to read... if we have two or more categories, that means you will have to visit more pages...

another issue is that many threads include a multiple questions... ex.. someone may ask in the same post about the value of a boat and a specific question about the engines... so you are going to end up with a number of things in the wrong place anyway.

the search works really well, unlike the search on the old forums... it is the quickest way to find a specific answer/topic.

i can't say i feel strongly about this, in fact i think that early on i was for splitting tehcnical/ general etc... but i think the current system works.

 

[administrator]

I actually have mixed feelings about it. There is another forum which I do visit occasionally for technical (non-Hatteras) information. When the forum began, it was small with only a few categories and it was easy to navigate. As it grew, it became more difficult to wade thru all of the posts to find information that I was interested in reading because most of it was in one category - much like we have here. However, the folks who run that forum went to the other extreme and split out different categories for everything imaginable. I rarely visit it now because it is very hard to figure out which category to browse for the information I'm looking for.

When I do, I take Pascal's approach and search for what I'm looking for because it's the only way I know to find something now in that forum. I guess I do miss being able to quickly browse that forum, like I did before to see if there were things I wanted to take the time to read or comment on.

I will be happy to structure the forum however the members feel would be best. Up until recently, I really felt it was OK to leave the General Discussion area as it is. However, I do see some logic now in creating a seperate category for General Boating Topics or Non-Hatteras Specific topics. We seem to have more of them lately. Such a category could be used to post non-Hatteras related threads such as the dangers of BUI or rendezvous information or general cruising threads, etc.

We could rename the General Discussion category to Hatteras Talk or something and require that all posts made to that section relate specifically to Hatteras Yachts in some form or fashion. We could also specify that this category is primarily of a technical nature and that digressions into other topics should be limited or made elsewhere.

My biggest concern, however, is that if we do this, the General Boating section would become a difficult spot to manage. We would need to caution that while this new area might be better place to digress into other areas - there would still be guidelines and it would NOT be a place where anything goes with inappropriate posts. I am creating some general forum usage guidlines which will soon be emailed to each user and posted in each section of the forum.

If we do create another category, I would be happy to go back for a short period and move over some of the non-Hatteras threads that seem to fit the scope of the General Boating category.

I am not in favor of splitting the forum up into a lot of different categories, but perhaps one more might work OK - within limits that would be enforced.

 

[dwaynec]

Doug,
I too have thought that maybe this is the time to split the forum. That being said, I don't like the idea of it being split. As long as I log into the forum on a regular basis I can see all of the new or recently replied to topics, and then I can read those that I am interested in. Besides, it is pleasant to read a purely non-technical thread from time to time. After all, when you get right down to it, we are just a bunch of boaters talking with each other about things that interest or concern us as it relates to boating and our boats.
Dwayne

 

[Traveler 45C]

Sorry, I'm not in favor of splitting it up either. I think its fine the way it is even if we do get "off Hatts" sometimes. The layout is such that one could simply not read a thread that doesn't interest them. Thats how I missed the one that got pulled.

 

[Pascal]

maybe a General Boating forum would be a good compromise...

one way to make multiple categories work is to have an active thread page which shows all the threads with traffic since your last visit (or since a set date / time... 2 hours, 6 hours, 12 hours, 1 day ...)

all active threads are shown on a single page... so you don't have to deal with going back and forth thru various sections. don't know if this forum software allows it. This is the only page i use on other forums with multiple categories/forums.

i think the real problem has been the large number of one liner replies we've seen... it's ok once in a while, but when you start getting more of these than actual posts within a thread, it's like static on AM radio...

 

[Freebird]

I will be happy to structure the forum however the members feel would be best. Up until recently, I really felt it was OK to leave the General Discussion area as it is. However, I do see some logic now in creating a seperate category for General Boating Topics or Non-Hatteras Specific topics. We seem to have more of them lately. Such a category could be used to post non-Hatteras related threads such as the dangers of BUI or rendezvous information or general cruising threads, etc.

QUOTE]

Doug,

I agree wholeheartedly with the need for a category for posting "non-Hatteras" threads. That is assuming information on cruising or rendezvous among Hatteras owners while onboard their Hatteras yachts is considered by some to be a "non-Hatteras" issue. I disagree with that view personally, but that's just my opinion.

As previously stated, I'm not complaining. I have certainly benefitted from the wealth of knowledge regarding technical questions I have posted about my Hatts. However, my primary goal in joining a Hatteras owners group was to "hang out" with people who shared my interest in boating in general, and Hatteras yachts in particular. To that end, I hoped to meet fellow owners both on-line and ultimately in person to enjoy our boats. I've obviously unintentionally offended certain members with my views and style, and trust I have adequately apologized to all those who were in fact offended. While I may have fallen short of my goal, I have attempted to conform to a requested change of pace.

In short, if threads about cruising are found to be non-specific to Hatteras yachts, then by all means, a seperate forum for these issues would seem to me to be a good idea. I glanced at the "1510 Club" linked to this site, and it is obvious those folks with that site are not experienceing anywhere near the success of this one. I'm not sure if that is due to the fact that they require a membership fee, or if there just aren't that many 1510 owners out there. Based on ownership numbers I've noticed here, the first would seem to be the case. However, that would seem to bring up another point. Does bigger translate into better?

I haven't tried to look at numbers, but I've wondered about the ratio of owners to non-owners on this site. I would think that actual owners of Hatteras yachts would have much more to contribute both in terms of shared knowledge, and chances of spending money at Sam's. I hope I'm not getting off track here, but I would have to consider limiting non-owners to only viewing posts as opposed to actually posting information. There are obviously notable exceptions for previous Hatteras owners (maybe a new category of member?) who are in between Hatts. However, I feel limiting non-owners would prevent threads we've seen lately for advertisements for cell phones, dating services, and other topics which are totally inappropriate for this site. I personally don't see how this limitation would keep would-be Hatteras owners from seeing and hearing the benefits of ownership from those who do in fact own them.

I apologize for being long-winded in this response. Once again, I don't feel there is anything wrong with things the way they are now. Hopefully I have not offered an opinion that is not wanted. In the end, I'm certain that you are the best judge on what is best for this site and for your business.

Sincerely,

 

[J's Dream]

I would have to consider limiting non-owners to only viewing posts as opposed to actually posting information. There are obviously notable exceptions for previous Hatteras owners (maybe a new category of member?) who are in between Hatts. However, I feel limiting non-owners would prevent threads we've seen lately for advertisements for cell phones, dating services, and other topics which are totally inappropriate for this site. I personally don't see how this limitation would keep would-be Hatteras owners from seeing and hearing the benefits of ownership from those who do in fact own them.

Here's the problem. How are those people interested in buying their first Hatteras supposed to ask questions to those of us "in the know"? They wouldn't be able to.

Sam's Marine is AWESOME. I made a special trip to NC from FL to see Tom Slane's place (Slane Marine) and Steve's place (Sam's Marine). Doug was there the day I was, and it was nice to see the brains of all this we have on here. If potential Hatteras owners can't get in here to learn before they buy, that takes away business from Sam's, and that's not cool.

FYI, if you should call Hatteras Yachts which I did today, and listen to the automated system, there is one plug for Sam's Marine and how vintage parts and information is available through them...and there is another plug for the FORUM itself! Keep this in mind when posting things on here maybe a little off topic, or worse. We are VERY lucky to have this available to us, and it is expanding exponentially. Alot of us here enjoy learning and talking about a common interest/love.

So, now that everyone's tired of reading this, here's my point. Topics should be aimed toward Hatteras and activities related to Hatteras (i.e. fishing/diving/running aground/etc). I don't see the need to split the forum into another section where topics can get rediculous. You all know the saying K.I.S.S. Well -- here it is, keep it simple. Remember, this is a Hatteras site, not a general boating site. For those who want general, don't leave all together...but take the general stuff to a site designed for it and post your Hatteras specific information for us to see! This is a direct quote of the subtitle of the General Discussion on our forum:

Anything & everything related to the Hatteras boating experience.

Lets keep it that way!

Jason

 

[Freebird]

Here's the problem. How are those people interested in buying their first Hatteras supposed to ask questions to those of us "in the know"? They wouldn't be able to.

Jason

Jason,

With all due respect, non-owners would have full access to over 3,000 threads which should cover most any topic they may have an interest in.

I did not suggest that they could not ask questions, they could certainly do this in the form of a reply to a thread posted by an owner. The suggestion I made (not allowing non-owners to START a thread) would, in my opinion, eliminate unwanted posts that do not pertain to this forum. Furthermore, to be perfectly blount, I wouldn't think there is a whole lot that non-owners could teach owners about their Hatts, and they are very unlikely to purchase Hatteras parts etc. from Sam's.

Simply put, the name of this site is hatterasowners.com. I think that says it all. Quite frankly, this is the only owners group I've seen where a member didn't have to be an owner. Try showing up with your Porsche at a Ferrari owner's rally and see what happens!

Sincerely,

The guy who talks too much

 

[J's Dream]

Jason,

The suggestion I made (not allowing non-owners to START a thread) would, in my opinion, eliminate unwanted posts that do not pertain to this forum.

Who determines if the post is unwanted? If a potential buyer is asking about the boat they're looking at...it certainly pertains to this forum. The suggestion you made represents such a small number of threads...and I happen to enjoy those people who are curious and excited about buying their first Hatteras.

 

[Pascal]

as much as i dont feel strongly about split the main forum, i feel VERY strongly against stopping non owners from posting (whether starting or replying to threads).

doens't make any sense, no benefits... this is one lousy idea for many reaons but the biggest one simply because dozens of "owners to be" have asked questions here and got great advice from owners helping them in making the right decisions... myself included.

as to splitting forums, looking at some of the recent threads, maybe it's not a bad idea as long as we keep it hatteras related... ex the following recent threads coudl have be posted in that new forum :
-detox
-erie canal
-hatt's off
-best looking
-sinking
-cummins
-stolen boat
although i dont think it shoudl become an anything goes forum... but it woudl unclutter the true hatteras forum.

 

[J's Dream]

although i dont think it shoudl become an anything goes forum... but it woudl unclutter the true hatteras forum.

Pascal,

Who is going to determine what goes? Are we going to turn into the forum on BoatUS? Or are we going to have moderators regulating 24-7?


Randy,

What about the boats wanted section? Now no one can post what boat they are looking for unless they already have one???

Just my .02. No more from me.

Jason

 

[Freebird]

Randy,

What about the boats wanted section? Now no one can post what boat they are looking for unless they already have one???

Just my .02. No more from me.

Jason

Jason,

One more thought, and that will do it for me as well. I'm not sure I understand your thinking on boats wanted.

For one, I doubt that there would be a response to a boat wanted ad posted by a non-owner from an owner who doesn't already have his boat listed on the site. Second, the non-owner can't list his non-Hatteras as being for sale on the site.

Forgive me if I somehow missed your point. But as Forrest said, "that's all I have to say about that".

 

[Freebird]

although i dont think it shoudl become an anything goes forum... but it woudl unclutter the true hatteras forum.

Pascal,

One more point on your take, and I'm finished with you too!

How can ANYTHING you do as a Hatteras owner while on a Hatteras yacht not be a topic of discussion on a Hatteras owners forum?

 

[Genesis]

I am strongly against locking the forum to non-owners.

For one thing, how do you prove ownership? DOC lookup? Who's going to administer that? What if you state-register instead of documenting? Most of those records are not public. Now what?

Second, someone thinking of buying should have the same access as someone who has bought, IMHO. I don't see the argument for that sort of exclusivity in "the club".

Third, its not been a problem up until now, nor can I see it being one in the future.......

Anyway, my 2 cents..... keep it was it is.

 

[Boss Lady]

I like the forum the way it is. I look at all new posts, and if I feel I have something to contribute I will post, if I don't have an interest or cannot contribute something to the discussion, I sit on the sidelines and watch the fray. It can be great entertainment, and just like TV channels, i can go watch something else more interesting, if it is a dry topic. The main thing is that the forums serve the interests and needs of the users. Where else can you find about 10 recommendations for a 35 year old neon bulb? I happen to like the Ladies and Gentlemen who make up this group of afficianados for Classic Hats. We will hit a few bumps along the way as new members join the group, but as long as we continue to focus on why someone would want to hang out in the looney bin, we can always work things out and even make new friends. Some people are opinionated, that is just life, I happen to like the challenges presented and watching how we as a group come up with answers. We have our super stars, and our own class clown, and our great sponsor "Sam's", so I think that the forum should stay the same.

cheers!

 

[Pascal]

Jason

same rules as now, just have the non strictly hatteras threads (like those listed) in a different section to unclutter the forum.

overall, just like now, threads should be related to hatteras and their use.

 

[Avenger]

Okay, a couple of issues have popped up here that I didn't anticipate.

Barring non-owners? Karl a.k.a. Genesis doesn't own a Hatteras right now (Yes, he needs to update his profile) Something that we hope he'll remedy soon, but, you're going to ban him from posting? I think not. I could edit my profile right now to say that I own a 2006 50C (I not only want to live in Theory, I have this really cool fantasy world too) Who's going to police this?

Search says we've got around 300 non-owner members, including the administrator. Many of them have something to contribute, Sea Eric, Red Hatt, Tony Athens, Passages, Mario G, just to pick a few off the non-owner list. Maybe some of these people just need to update their profile, but even if they're correct we'd be shooting ourselves in the foot to kick these people off. For these and other reasons stated previously I have no problem with non-owners being involved. It's an elite group as it is, we don't need to make it more exclusive.

Non-Hatt related threads. I don't think I've ever seen a thread booted unless it was really inappropriate. It's a pretty nice community we have here, if something wanders off topic it's usually not a problem. Some of them are really interesting. That being said, I wasn't suggesting that we turn this into a general boating forum. Hatteras is our identity, and IMHO what makes this forum unique. Again, I think we'd do ourselves a disservice if we changed that.

My intent in floating the question was to try to make the forum easier to use, especially for the new guys. When I found the forum I spent a lot of time reviewing all the threads from day one to familiarize myself with the way things were done around here. If I started today it's unlikely that I'd be able to do that. At the rate we're growing, it will be impossible very soon. I think the user guide will go a long way toward reducing new duplicate threads and making members aware of how to maximize the resource we have here. Clearly, over categorizing will not improve things either. I was hoping that some member input would help identify if there were specific areas that could be grouped. Engine information or boat systems categories for example.

Another thought was that a social or travel category might help is to enhance member contact. Threads on organizing a group cruise, for example, are a great way for members to meet. If there was an area for social activities, i.e. "Hey guys, I'm going to be in West Palm Beach to visit the in-laws, is there anybody in the area who'd like to get together for lunch or dinner?" Or "I'm planning a trip to Maryland, anybody know any marinas to stay at? - Yes, here's one and while you're there stop by." Again, this is a pretty elite group, we have something in common and I for one, have made some really nice social contacts here. I thought encouraging this would be a benefit to our "community."

And finally (I know. When's this guy going to get off the soapbox?) if we think it may need to be reorganized, at the rate this is growing it would be better to do it now. It may already be too much of a can-o-worms. However, since the "red-headed-stepchild" seems to be the only member who really feels strongly about it.... Hey, I wasn't married to the idea, I just thought it deserved some discussion before it got overwhelming.

 

[administrator]

While I did choose to name the forum "Hatteras Owners Forum" when it was started, it was never intended to be exclusive to those who presently own a Hatteras.

Past, present, and future owners are now and will always be welcome. Others who have close ties to the Hatteras community and have things to contribute are also welcome.

It's really a mute point anyway because I have absolutely no way to enforce it.

Sam's Marine is honored to facilitate this resource and converse with those on the forum who are Hatteras owners and those who aspire to be.