Bow Pulpit removal 43 M/Y

[Dan Mapes]

Hopefully it doesn't come to that! I didn't know about Slane (bless me Father for I have sinned) Marine but we are probably below the level of folks that frequent them for restoration.

 

[Tim Powell]

Hopefully it doesn't come to that! I didn't know about Slane (bless me Father for I have sinned) Marine but we are probably below the level of folks that frequent them for restoration.

O NO i just thought you may be ale to get a new one somewhat cheap. I have seen it advertised a couple of times...... I really enjoyed your post i can relate. I went into the rope locker only to see water and smell mildew. Away after taking the wench off i found same as you but thank goodness not as deep. we doug out all the bad stuff and re glassed i belive i will check again to be sure all is well it just means taking off the winch....
Can not wait to see the finished project

 

[Vincentc]

The plywood underside of your pulpit looks familiar. I cut off bad sections with a skill saw and replaced them with plywood and epoxy. I may have also used a multi tool which must have been made for rotten wood surgery. Much easier than the job of removing the pulpit.

 

[Dan Mapes]

It's in the shop now and I just got back after a talk with the man about how we are going forward. Fortunately we both saw things the same way. Dice up the would with a saw and air chisel it out. Then replace it with epoxy coated plywood. Next paint the underside, flip it over.
Then clean up the holes from the teak and paint it up.

The "filler" that is between the wood and fiberglass is a "high density putty" and that ch1t is like concrete. It ain't going anywhere. So the surfaces get cleaned up a bit and we'll remount it minus the teak. First a dry fit with 4 bolts to fore and two aft. Then we flip it put a bead around the perimeter of the wood and drop it onto blocks for alignment with long bolts. One aligned it goes on for good (hopefully).

This one has more pixels and should contain more detail.

 

[Triskele]

A small leak caused big trouble over time. I believe it was leak under bow pulpit that destroyed over half the core in front deck. Note in picture below how it was port side that sustained most damage - the generator is on port side and boat list that way, thus the starboard side OK. Note the upper deck - core destroyed because of the mast step leaking. I also found picture of that piece of plywood under the bow pulpit that was screwed to deck.

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Is that the new core in the bow picture (first pic)? If so is it plywood? If so, what kind did you use?

 

[Triskele]

Your work looks good, better than mine at that stage. I looked back thru my pictures to refresh my memory and found a few that might be of interest.

View attachment 17344View attachment 17345

Screw locations are noted by the orange circles and the sticky tabs. Some screws cannot be reached. Prying and shimming from the back did not do it for me. I about gave up, then I positioned the boat where the pulpit extended over land. I stood on shore and pushed the pulpit up working it up and down from the front until it finally broke loose. The plywood pad was in bad shape and required some surgery and plywood implants. I have photos showing how I did it.

Too late for these projects, but for others looking to take on this job, consider replacing the plywood under the bow pulpit with Starboard HDPE plastic. Waterproof and stout. Can saw and drill like wood. West Marine carries it.

 

[bobk]

Too late for these projects, but for others looking to take on this job, consider replacing the plywood under the bow pulpit with Starboard HDPE plastic. Waterproof and stout. Can saw and drill like wood. West Marine carries it.

That will not work. Neither epoxy or polyester will adhere to polyethylene (HDPE = high density polyethylene).

Bobk

 

[Boatsb]

And it does not saw and drill like wood. It will melt if allowed to heat.

Wrong material for the job.

 

[Triskele]

Hmmmm...was going to let this pass. But now that I am being attacked on two fronts feel I best muster a response. My thread was simply a suggestion in the event no one had previously considered it. (Full disclosure, I have not tried this nor have experience with the applicatiation.) However, I will refer you to the information posted on the West Marine site that says the material "will" cut, drill, shape and rout using standard woodworking tools. http://www.westmarine.com/buy/west-marine--marine-lumber-plastic-building-material--P004_135_001_009 If your point is that it will not drill or cut like wood, you got me there. Obviously, it is not wood. Additionally, yes, I understand that it will not adhere with adhesives such as epoxies. However, it will adhere with wood screws to the top of the deck (which is the way the plywood was originally fastened down) and seal with Dow 795 (silicon). As for it's tolerance to heat, I have no experience, but I do not intend to flame or blow torch it. Inside the bow pulpit I do not expect temperatures to rise to the point where the stuff melts, but I could be wrong.

It is my understanding that the only purpose of the plywood piece between the deck and bow pulpit is to stabilize and prevent horizontal torqueing of the bow pulpit. If so, then Starboard once sealed, fastened and secured should serve the same purpose. In fact, I'm not even sure the original design with plywood really matters or was sound from the start. There are six stout bolts holding down the pulpit. I doubt that the plywood adds much additional structural integrity...expecially after it has become rot. And therein lies the primary difference. Starboard (or for that matter any other HDPE or polycarbonate) provides equal structure with out the risk of being compromised by water or rot.

 

[bobk]

Hmmmm...was going to let this pass. But now that I am being attacked on two fronts feel I best muster a response. My thread was simply a suggestion in the event no one had previously considered it. (Full disclosure, I have not tried this nor have experience with the applicatiation.) However, I will refer you to the information posted on the West Marine site that says the material "will" cut, drill, shape and rout using standard woodworking tools. http://www.westmarine.com/buy/west-marine--marine-lumber-plastic-building-material--P004_135_001_009 If your point is that it will not drill or cut like wood, you got me there. Obviously, it is not wood. Additionally, yes, I understand that it will not adhere with adhesives such as epoxies. However, it will adhere with wood screws to the top of the deck (which is the way the plywood was originally fastened down) and seal with Dow 795 (silicon). As for it's tolerance to heat, I have no experience, but I do not intend to flame or blow torch it. Inside the bow pulpit I do not expect temperatures to rise to the point where the stuff melts, but I could be wrong.

It is my understanding that the only purpose of the plywood piece between the deck and bow pulpit is to stabilize and prevent horizontal torqueing of the bow pulpit. If so, then Starboard once sealed, fastened and secured should serve the same purpose. In fact, I'm not even sure the original design with plywood really matters or was sound from the start. There are six stout bolts holding down the pulpit. I doubt that the plywood adds much additional structural integrity...expecially after it has become rot. And therein lies the primary difference. Starboard (or for that matter any other HDPE or polycarbonate) provides equal structure with out the risk of being compromised by water or rot.

Triskele,

I'm sorry you mistake my post as an attack. I wrote it to prevent someone from making a mistake. I'll also add that my background includes 42 years as a polymer scientist doing research on many different plastics and elastomers including failure analyses on several, as well as building fiberglass boats back in the 1950's. Polyethylene is not as strong or as stiff as plywood and if that strength is needed in the pulpit, it's not going to be the same. Folks obviously do as they wish, but sometimes that doesn't work out well. I'm trying to help. No offense intended.

Bobk

 

[Triskele]

Triskele,

I'm sorry you mistake my post as an attack. I wrote it to prevent someone from making a mistake. I'll also add that my background includes 42 years as a polymer scientist doing research on many different plastics and elastomers including failure analyses on several, as well as building fiberglass boats back in the 1950's. Polyethylene is not as strong or as stiff as plywood and if that strength is needed in the pulpit, it's not going to be the same. Folks obviously do as they wish, but sometimes that doesn't work out well. I'm trying to help. No offense intended.

Bobk

Bob...

No worries. However, I do appreciate your respectful and polite reply. Thank you for that. For the most part, I suspected your intent was to warn me and others off from making a mistake or taking unnecessary risk. I don't mind being told I am wrong. I just like being told by a credible source who can support their case (as in site experience or data...which you appear to be able to do). Since I don't know you personally, I will have to take you on your word that you are who you say you are, but since this is a public forum I am confident you would not risk overstating your credentials and misrepresent yourself. Having said that, I too have a background in chemistry (B.S.), but never practiced. I know enough to get myself into trouble or step into dog doo...which I have apparently just done. This is no stranger to me. In fact, I run into it quite often at the poker table when someone has a better hand than me. In addition to public humiliation, it can be quite expensive. Thank you again for your advice and valuable contribution to this forum.

 

[Triskele]

Has anyone pulled the pulpit off and how did it go? The rub rail was easy enough but the anchor roller is stuck down to the pulpit really well.
It appears the bow rail is one piece and easily detached from the pulpit but I am not sure I want to leave it hanging so it may come off completely unless I can prop it up at the bow point.

The windlass is out, and all of the bolts are out as well. When I redid the core under it, I shaved off all of the wood screws that were holding some plywood in place under the pulpit.

So if you have any input pass it along (please).

Dan...

Have a question about your need to remove the bow pulpit. In Fall of 2014, you repaired core rot under the bow pulpit by entering from the bottom side. Then around Spring of 2015, you removed the bow pulpit. Wondering if these two issues were related or different? The reason I ask is that my first plan to repair the core beneath the bow pulpit was to remove the pulpit, pull up the glass and repair the core by going in from the top. However, I am now rethinking that approach. After sounding the deck, the rot looks to be contained within the Starboard half of the deck under the pulpit and in front of the bulkhead. Since I am doing the work myself in the water (not on the hard) and don't have assistance, removing the pulpit will be a royal PITA. Am starting to think that if I can get around removing the bow pulpit by going in from the bottom, that may be "easier" (as if any of this stuff is easy). Had wanted to avoid working against gravity and upside down, but don't think it will be so bad given the area is manageable. The thing I don't want to have happen is to go in from the bottom of the deck and then find I still have to remove the bow pulpit for some unforeseen reason. I guess that is what I was wondering in your case. Did you find you still had to remove the bow pulpit to complete your deck repair or was it for a different reason all together. Thanks! Jay

 

[bobk]

If you have not come across it, here is a link to the repair on my 48. I caught the wet core damage before it got much past the pulpit so the repair was from above. Note the efforts to prevent a recurrence as described. The repair is now four years old and no further issues. This area is part of my biannual inspection with a moisture meter.

http://www.samsmarine.com/forums/sh...as-Needed-for-Re-sealing-Pulpit-and-Fore-Deck

Bobk

 

[Walter P]

Triskele,

Having just recently done the same job that you are contemplating I don't see how you can do a proper job working from the bottom. The pulpit is quite heavy at probably 200 lbs and in my case the plywood was all rotted out under it. In order to replace the plywood you need to remove the pulpit, as nasty a job as it will be. You can repair the deck core from the bottom, but working overhead with resin dripping down over everything doesn't strike me as too much fun. I elected to cut the top skin off and replace the core and replace the top skin. The pulpit was repaired using several layers of plywood encapsulated in Epoxy.

BTW, bobk is quite modest regarding his background.... He was a top chemist with Dupont for most of his career and has a PhD in chemistry. His advice has been very valuable to me and others but you can proceed as you wish. In any event have fun, it's a PITA job that you may want to contract a yard with experience to do it.

Walt

 

[Triskele]

If you have not come across it, here is a link to the repair on my 48. I caught the wet core damage before it got much past the pulpit so the repair was from above. Note the efforts to prevent a recurrence as described. The repair is now four years old and no further issues. This area is part of my biannual inspection with a moisture meter.

http://www.samsmarine.com/forums/sh...as-Needed-for-Re-sealing-Pulpit-and-Fore-Deck

Bobk

Thanks Bob! Skimmed over the material a while back. Now that I am at the stage of attacking the deck, am rereading the post and giving it a thorough once and over. Getting a better handle on it second time through.

 

[spartonboat1]

Posting to end:
Recommend "Coosa Board", instead of marine plywood or Starboard. Totally rotproof, slightly heavier than Balsa, lighter than plywood. Just re-built a flybridge with Coosa, and it is solid like a rock and West System epoxy adhered to it well. Need to update my post about all that.

 

[Boatsb]

I'm replacing a transom on a cc with epoxy and coosa.

What a job shaping it. Coosa dust is dirty nasty stuff. I'm pretty good about keeping the mess to a minimum but I had to shape it to fill in a few spots.