Bilge hose check valves, Yes or No?

[Eddieclemons]

[FONT=&quot]Bilge check valves, Yes or No??
Currently replacing bilge pumps, and hoses.

1. One is in the forward bilge, usually a AC condensation drain sump.

2. 2nd is forward in the ER between the engines. Usually a AC condensation drain sump.

Should they be there or no?[/FONT]

 

[bostonhatteras]

Rule pumps, or any centrifugal pump, specifically prohibit check valves. Other type pumps may be able to use them such as diaphram or vane type. If it were me I'd eliminate that entire mess and run only hose.

 

[Pascal]

It an only a matter of time before they jam. There was only one case where I had to use one, it was a flat bilge in a lazarette with a small sump in the floor which was to shallow. Pump would run but too much water would flow back.

In your case are they bilge pumps or sump pumps? Is the AC condensation going in the bilge or in a sump box?

But worst than check valves are rule switches. I still have one on my boat, all the others are now ultra switches. I did all the bilge pumps about 7 or 8 years ago, with new wiring plumbing etc to 5 3700s and new switches. 4 have failed since, one burning up its pump. Rule switches were great years ago but have become worthless

 

[JimmyB]

One solution for pump switches is to add a relay to actually switch the pump on and off
and let the pump switch kick the relay. A 12 volt 100 amp relay is cheap.
This eliminates the reverse voltage you get switching an electric motor on and off.

 

[SEVEN]

Hose only.

 

[Captain Ralph]

Bilge check valves,

Should they be there or no?

No
No
No
Don't forget the rise in the discharge hose above the outlet thru hull.

With that said, if you must have them; use serviceable & non metallic valves.
Examples only;
https://www.westmarine.com/bosworth-sea-lect-in-line-check-valves-P011_332_003_515.html
https://www.westmarine.com/whale-pumps-1-1-2inch-plastic-check-valve-100711.html

 

[cww]

One solution for pump switches is to add a relay to actually switch the pump on and off
and let the pump switch kick the relay. A 12 volt 100 amp relay is cheap.
This eliminates the reverse voltage you get switching an electric motor on and off.

That's never how they fail though. They start sticking in the up position which burns up the (very expensive 32v) bilge pumps once you're not on the boat. I have lost count of how many times that's happened to me, and how many times I've had to go crawling in the bilge underway and screw with the float switch because the light on the helm won't go off.

Once they start doing that, you can clean it out and WD40 it, and it'll start working again for a little while, but eventually no matter what you do they still stick in the up position at which point you just have to replace them. You only get a couple years in between replacements. It's something defective about the hinge design. 20 years ago they didn't do this, but the current Rule switches all eventually do this.

I haven't had this issue since I took Pascal's suggestion and put in Ultra switches 3 years ago, since then I haven't had a single problem, and haven't had to screw with a switch once, and haven't had to replace another $400 bilge pump.

 

[bostonhatteras]

Since Pascal brought up pump switches, here's arguably the best you can get. https://ultrasafetysystems.com/contain.php?param=pumpswitch_infor You'll never need to replace it, that's for certain

 

[jim rosenthal]

You might also see if you can get smooth-wall hose which will increase the flow rates of the pumps, as that corrugated hose makes the pump have to work harder.

I agree with no check valves, but you should have loops above the waterline as well.

I did have an Ultra pump switch fail. It was easily 25 years old, maybe older. They are the most reliable ones out there.

 

[dsharp]

It an only a matter of time before they jam. There was only one case where I had to use one, it was a flat bilge in a lazarette with a small sump in the floor which was to shallow. Pump would run but too much water would flow back.

In your case are they bilge pumps or sump pumps? Is the AC condensation going in the bilge or in a sump box?

But worst than check valves are rule switches. I still have one on my boat, all the others are now ultra switches. I did all the bilge pumps about 7 or 8 years ago, with new wiring plumbing etc to 5 3700s and new switches. 4 have failed since, one burning up its pump. Rule switches were great years ago but have become worthless

They don’t have mercury in the Rule float switches anymore. They used to last 5-10years.

 

[Eddieclemons]

I already plan on smooth hose, Ultra switches, Johnson Bilge pumps/SR with Alarms on the ER bilges and Rule/Jr on the Sumps.......w no checks. Thanks for all the info.

 

[Pascal]

These ribbed hoses, both the old hatteras grey hoses and the black/clear ones get stiff with time and crack easily.

 

[SKYCHENEY]

I have only ever changed out one float switch in the 21 years I have owned the boat. But my pumps only run when I test them because the bilge is always dry.

 

[Pascal]

I have only ever changed out one float switch in the 21 years I have owned the boat. But my pumps only run when I test them because the bilge is always dry.

Must be the old mercury switches …

 

[Briankinley2004]

These ribbed hoses, both the old hatteras grey hoses and the black/clear ones get stiff with time and crack easily.

So do I

 

[Captain Ralph]

Must be the old mercury switches …

The good ole mercury switches do not click when the float swings.
The newer (Sheet) switches do.

We still have a couple of 46 year old Non-Clickers on our Bertram.
Seems the wires failed before the (mercury) switch does forcing some other original switches to be replaced long ago.

Wish I knew what was going on before I replaced some of the other original switches.
Maybe could of fix and re-used them.

On the later switches that click;
Some work a week, some work for several months.
When you live-aboard, you know quickly when a bilge or sump pump is not working.

We keep spares and lately, our installed switches have been repeatably reliable. It has taken some patience and lots of warranty replacements but we feel good about the current in-use bilge and sump Rule switches.

We have no way of knowing any date codes on the later switches (made on Monday, Wednesday or Friday) or after a holiday hangover (Ford Issues). Just kept up on replacements till our float issues went aweigh.

Good luck to all that still shop for Rule float switches.

 

[rwaldrop13]

Pau Hana had what I found out were Hatteras-installed check valves in the original bilge discharge hoses. I removed them and put in anti-siphon fittings, and it seemed to work pretty well. I replaced all the pumps, discharge hoses and clamps.

 

[bostonhatteras]

Pau Hana had what I found out were Hatteras-installed check valves in the original bilge discharge hoses. I removed them and put in anti-siphon fittings, and it seemed to work pretty well. I replaced all the pumps, discharge hoses and clamps.

Thats interesting that the check valves were factory issue. Some of the old bilge pumps like lovitt needed all the help they could get.

 

[GCSI]

Eddie: The forward bilge will backflow when running at hull speed with a full load and tender on bow. Tried many variations of “loops” within available space, never was able to cure backflow and resultant short cycling of bow bilge pump; hence the check valve.
Brett

 

[SKYCHENEY]

Eddie: The forward bilge will backflow when running at hull speed with a full load and tender on bow. Tried many variations of “loops” within available space, never was able to cure backflow and resultant short cycling of bow bilge pump; hence the check valve.
Brett

We had the same problem on the bow of a 60C. There was just no way to stop the backflow at hull speed without a check valve. All other pumps were fine with just the loop.