Air Conditioner Sizes on 48 YF?

[spcoolin]

Steve,
I don't want to hijack this thread, but have a quick question. The EBO unit you show looks a lot like I remember my air handlers looking. Does it seem likely to you that this would be what I have in a 1990 Ocean CPMY? I'd really rather not disassemble all that stuff to get a close look again if I can avoid it, but if you think this is logical, I'll put that type designation aside in case I need to discuss it with you again later.
Thanks,

Actually it's good that you ask...It's info for Paul that I forgot/didn't mention...Paul see below for your air handler/s replacement/s...You can then see retail pricing on my site in the Cruisair price book pg 6...

Yes the EBO units were very common...Ocean used them as well as Hatteras, and all other builders...They were produced in sizes from 4K to 16K, and actually became the primary Cruisair design...The one pictured is really a Marine Air model (didn't have Cruisair pic) which was a EBO copy...

They had rotatable blowers and worked very well...The only draw back was depth (front to back) because the motor was external & stuck out the back...That's were you might have used the EBS I pictured in the aluminum box because it's motor was internal and therefore not as deep...

Drawback to the EBS was the blower could not be rotated and they only made it in a 12K & 16K...Well they did make some smaller in early production days (Hatt 45C series 1 used a smaller EBS for Mstr/Salon) but those were not produced for long...

The EBS-12 & 16 (which is part of your flybridge overhead units) can still be ordered (but not in current price list) and the EBO's have discontinued as well...

The replacement for the EBO's started out as a EBU with internal HV (High Velocity) blower (no more motor sticking out the back)...Then went to EBA & REU...Don't ask because I'm not sure what the minor differences were except maybe the drain pan & mounting...The EBO & EBU needed an additional Mounting Frame if it was to be mounted on deck instead of directly to a vertical bulkhead (bulkhead mounting was also not provided for with the EBS units)

The difference in blowers from a EBO to Later EBU, EBA, or the new TV would be like:



To this:



Sorry for the lousy pics but that's all I have on the computer right now...

Now with the Cruisair, Marine Air, Dometic merger, they call it a TV-x (x = size) for TurboVap and it is the primary air handler available/listed...One air handler pretty much fits all below deck applications (meaning non overhead)...

Paul...Look at "TurboVaps (R-417A/R-22) " Then pick your sizes & voltage.

Steve~

Edit: BTW...Those two used blowers pictured in this post are available for sale...They were take offs from otherwise fried units.

 

[silverpaul]

Sure...I will need model numbers off the condensing units in the engine room for actual system sizes.

They should be located on the top of the electrical box covers in-between the service valves of the unit...The cover is removable with one 1/4" head screw (if you can't read it) It slides upwards to remove.

If that label is not readable then look inside the box at the strap that holds the capacitors in place....Most units had the model # written on that strap with a Sharpie...

As far as pricing...This is where we need to go to e-mail, and you can e-mail me thru the Contact Steve link on the top of the home page of my site...

Steve~

OK I could not get a clear view of the condensing units as a previous owner had routed water pipes over the shelf on top of the units but I took some photos and I am pretty sure the boat documentation is correct and they are two WFAH-16. The Master SR unit works quite well and is not too loud - need here is for heating. The salon unit in the main issue- again heating is the primary need. The boat documents are difficult to read for the for the air handlers but what I can decode is: Bow: ?FB-7, MSR": ?FB-10, Salon: ???-16. I have photos
View attachment 11071


I will contact you by email later.

Paul

 

[spcoolin]

Been talking to Paul via email about his options, but thought I would post here about his latest photos for those that may be interested/watching...

Everything I see in the above two shots tells me he does have the original 1974 Hatteras installed Cruisair equipment...So what 37 years & counting ?...Not often you hear of, or see a home system lasting that long...

The condensing unit/s are indeed WFAH-16's with the old Copeland compressor (Later they changed to Tecumseh) The Copeland was almost bullet proof, but was heavy, tall, and very inefficient (Power/Amp Hog)

The air handler is a EBS-16 (like I pictured with the duct box on top) but his is the oldest version that had a larger blower (took more depth) than the one I pictured, and the model # then changed to EBS-16S.

So it's pretty much as we had been discussing...Just it is some very old stuff that in that kind of condition, is not really worth putting much money into unless you are a history buff and want to keep everything original...Yes it can be made fully operational, but at what cost & how much longer should it be expected to last ?

One thing that can be done since his equipment is still operating (albeit likely not up to even original standards) is to replace/retrofit in stages...Self Contained is a viable option too which clears up engine room space and lets him start completely new with each upgrade....Also no refrigerant issues to deal with since they come factory charged with no tubing joints to make, leaks to trace or repair before evacuation & charging...So a true DIY option...

I have to say that I have always been not so big a fan of self contained units...We always asked/said...Do you want "window shakers" in your yacht ? Because the compressor noise then moves to the living space...

But with the advancement of the most current SC units it's hard to find much fault...Running seawater that distance is the biggest drawback....But they are at least 27% more efficient than the systems pictured above...and Quieter too...

Steve~

 

[z28jimi]

Steve,
What size lines are required to move the seawater on the new self-contained units? I'm guessing that my two oldest split units may not have many years left, and would like to look into alternatives.

 

[spcoolin]

No difference in condenser size on the units...Still 5/8" ID hose...

Now if you want to run to a remote manifold centrally located & then split to multiple SC units, you may want to supply that splitter/manifold with 3/4" ID hose from the pump, but the outlets of the manifold should still be 5/8"
If you do the same thing utilizing a central overboard manifold, it would be 5/8" from the units, then maybe 1" or larger to the overboard thru hull (depending on how many units & size of pump)

Trick is to have enough pump for total BTU without over sizing much...Then not restricting that pump & causing cavitation inside the pump head by restricting plumbing...Doing this properly will limit marine growth too....It's one of the drawbacks to running seawater long distances such as is done with SC units all over the boat...

Now if you have a unused thru hull nearby the SC unit (such as a head intake that was converted to fresh water) you can have individual strainers/pumps and water is then run a short distance which is better all around...Plus you have redundancy...If one strainer or pump goes down...The whole boat is not without A/C....

Steve~

 

[silverpaul]

Hi Steve,
Ran into a problem trying to slow the fan. Removed the warning label and put a small screwdriver in the hole and felt for the slot. There was a spark smoke and the fan stopped! I removed the controller opened it and apparently the TRIAC blew. I can't see what shorted unless the body of the main pot is live. Anyway, is there a source for the speed control? It looks like a simple 'light dimmer' style of TRIAC controller.

Thanks,

Paul

 

[spcoolin]

Hi Steve,
Ran into a problem trying to slow the fan. Removed the warning label and put a small screwdriver in the hole and felt for the slot. There was a spark smoke and the fan stopped! I removed the controller opened it and apparently the TRIAC blew. I can't see what shorted unless the body of the main pot is live. Anyway, is there a source for the speed control? It looks like a simple 'light dimmer' style of TRIAC controller.

Thanks,

Paul

I answered your e-mail Paul...Let me know if you found one locally, or want me to ship...

Steve~

 

[silverpaul]

My refurbishment project is back to the subject of heating A/C on my 1974 Hatteras 48 YF.

I replaced the frozen rusted block that was once a March pump and fired it up only to have sea water spraying out of the corroded copper pipes on the cooling inputs to both condensing units. Time for something new!

Budget is tight so I only want to replace the salon EBS-16 with a self contained unit and for now just use fan heater in the master and V-berth when it is cold and fans when it is warm.


Regarding the installation, will I have to fabricate some sort of ductwork from the blower to the outlet grill in the top of the cabinet and seal the edges? That way the cabinet will be one large inlet plenum (cooling water and electrical lines sealed from the engine room because it will be low pressure 'sucking'). Or is it better/possible to duct the return air to the unit and keep the cabinet as a positive pressure outlet chamber??

Steve, can you quote me the best price for a 16K self contained unit to fit in the cabinet that currently holds the EBS-16.


Thanks,

Paul
'Freeway' 1974 Hatteras 48YF

 

[Boatsb]

Paul you may not of heard but sadly Steve passed away last month.

 

[silverpaul]

Oh no I had not.

How sad. Thank you for letting me know.