a/c Outboard Strainer

[Freestyle]

After cleaning the inboard a/c strainer every two hours I decided to go over the side. When painting the bottom the yard did not re-affix the outboard a/c strainer. Before I yell at them I thought I would learn about my options.

1. Can a new strainer be attached to the bottom while in water (1976 43 DC with about 1 inch fiberglass in that area)?

2. Have there been improvements in this type of strainer in the last 30 years and should I upgrade even though the other one was no trouble?

Thanks for the help.

Bruce
Freestyle
1976 43 DC
At anchor Longboat Pass

 

[Jaxfishgyd]

I replaced the A/C clamshell on our 43' 2 years ago when we had it hauled out to paint the hull, do a bottom job, have the props balanced ect....

The original one on my 1973 was small and we replaced it with a much larger size one as the small one got clogged up a lot and caused one of our units to overheat due to lack of water (at a cost of several hundreds of bucks).
Have had zero problems since then...... Sometimes bigger is better (within reason).

As far as putting the clamshell on while the boat is in the water........ Will let the oldtimers answer that one.. Would seem like it could be done.... After all, what was done to the existing screw holes when the old one was taken off??

 

[Genesis]

I wouldn't.

There is always the possibility that you drill too deeply..... Yes, its a small hole, but a hole nonetheless!

Also you want to use 4200 around the perimeter of the strainer, which is going to be difficult to accomplish underwater.

 

[jim rosenthal]

Bruce, do a haulout. Maybe the marina, which didn't do this right to begin with, will haul you. Trying to do it in the water is asking for trouble. Sorry.

 

[Angela]

I wouldn't.

There is always the possibility that you drill too deeply..... Yes, its a small hole, but a hole nonetheless!

Also you want to use 4200 around the perimeter of the strainer, which is going to be difficult to accomplish underwater.

Can I remove an existing strainer from the bottom and then put it back on, all while in the water? Here's my problem: I need to clean the strainer for the air conditioner pump, but the seacock is frozen. I can open the cover to the sea strainer, yank the basket out and replace the cover while I go clean the basket and it is seemingly simple. BUT....while "practicing" on another sea strainer that did have a working seacock, it took a little time (not a long time, but when water is pouring in, it may seem like an eternity) to get the basket out due to hard crud at the mouth of the opening where the basket comes out. Then, I saw that the cork seal in the lid had deteriorated to gunk and would not seal when I put it back on. So, I need to make or go get another seal for that. No problem...that sea cock is closed. Fortunately, the AC pump sea strainer appears to be in much better shape than that other one I practiced on, so I may be getting concerned all for nothing.

But since I can't close the AC sea seacock, and given what I just learned about how the seals can be a can of worms when the strainer is opened, I want to be prepared to dive the boat and put a plug in the intake opening. There is one of those bronze strainers under there. Can I simply unscrew it and remove it, and then put it back on in the same screw holes with the same screws, or do I have to use sealant to put it back on? I don't really see any way to effectively stop the water flow in case I get in trouble here, other than to stuff a rag into the strainer where the basket goes, and replace the cap but that may only minimize the water flow, and not stop it. Hopefully, none of this will happen, but I'm pondering the "what if" if I can't get the cap to seal when I'm done. Yes, I WILL have extra gaskets on hand to replace the old one if need be.

Access is just terrible. The frozen sea cock is located directly under the large fiberglass exhaust tube with the head hoses around each side of it, as if they were trying to hide it like an Easter egg. The strainer I need to clean is located right next to it - a difficult place to work in the first place, and even more nerving with water coming in.

Sorry for the long post, but I wanted to tell you WHY I think I might need to get a plug in from the bottom of the hull.

I WILL be rebuilding seacocks on my next haulout!

 

[fixin-to-cruise]

Maybe your strainer just fell off. I noticed that the screws get loose from removing the strainers at each haulout. I am thinking about replacing my external strainers with a Groco model that has a permanent mount ring that screws onto the hull and a removable external strainer that screws into the mount ring with machine screws. This is the link: http://www.groco.net/images/strainers/sc-05-450.gif

I wouldn't hesitate to put the strainer back on underwater to get to the next haulout. You might be better off to talk to the yard get some compensation for your next haulout (free lay days, etc.) and replace the strainer yourself. They will probably deny that it was their fault anyway.

I've had good results with freeing frozen seacocks by just using a piece of pipe to extend the handle and gradually getting the thing to move... Some have been completely frozen up but they can be coaxed back to normal operation.

 

[Genesis]

The problem Angela is that the screws really don't do much of the work - the sealant does. There's quite a bit of load taken on scoop strainers while under way, and if it rips off yuu've got nothing.....

I would be very careful playing with seacocks that can't be moved while in the water. If its corroded internally and snaps off you're gonna need that haul RIGHT NOW!

 

[Freestyle]

I'm startled to see my old thread. Embree Marine in St Petersburg let me pull in, hauled me out, and put on a new strainer gratis. It turned out not to have been their fault as evidenced by the trail left by the departing strainer.

Angela, consider diving the boat and stuffing a trash bag around the strainer. It should slow the flow.

Bruce

 

[Angela]

Thank you, Karl. I didn't try to overly force the seacock for the very reason you mentioned. Yeah, I'm scared of THAT scenario. I previously tried a short (because nothing long fits under there!) cheater bar, but not to the point of a lot of force. I have had some that needed just that little nudge that a cheater bar can give, and then they turn by hand back and forth. That wasn't the case with this one, so I let it be.

Well, I'll just have to tackle it with the situation I have. Pascal does it successfully all the time since his seacock is frozen, too. I'm just nervous about the "what if" factor since I haven't done it and am not completely sure of the condition inside the strainer, like Pascal is with his - he knows his basket is going to slide right out and that his cap will seal because he's been maintaining his. I don't know when mine was done last. The AC pump is fairly new, and the strainer for it does not have crud growing in it like the one I practiced on yesterday - that one goes to a head nobody uses and I suspect it didn't get much attention. But - the seacock turns with ease - figures.

If something goes horribly wrong, then I can go under, remove the exterior strainer and plug it at that point, then come back inside and work on plugging it from the inside by removing the strainer from the seacock for the ride to the yard. In that scenario, I won't have to worry about getting the cover back on since I'd have to haul out at that point anyway; that is, assuming I don't have a fear-induced heart attack in the process!

Bilge pumps and float switches are working so, the stage is set....

Fixin-to-cruise - thanks for the suggestion that perhaps the exterior strainer is missing. I'll check that, but I don't really have any symptoms to believe that's the case, but I should go look at that anyway just to make sure. I did just have the bottom painted, as well as all of the running gear serviced, a new shaft, etc. in May. If it's missing, I'll be calling the yard. I hope that's not the case - I've been real happy with the work they did. I'm cleaning the strainer because I haven't done that yet since I've owned the boat and Pascal tells me I should be doing that every month. Hopefully, it's not going to be too bad. I have a good flow of water through here since I'm sort of sitting right out in the ICW rather than in a protected area like Pascal is. So, I hope that would help with keeping the sea grass away a little better.

 

[Genesis]

I rarely had to clean my AC strainers, but I didn't have it running unless I was on board - which is not all the time. Stagnant water doesn't support growth as the oxygen gets depleted and the critters die.

If you're living on the boat then it becomes more of a problem......

 

[Angela]

Yep, I live here, so it runs 24/7. I've only turned off the water pump to switch from shore power to genny power. It does not cycle on and off with the compressors. I wish it did, or is that just another relay to go bad? I should probably get a spare water pump to keep on board. This one really gets a work out, but I suppose they are designed for it. I wonder what its expected life span is.

I am sooooooo looking forward to winter when I can turn all of that off and open the windows! Pascal tells me it will be around November before I can do that.

 

[Genesis]

The good AC water pumps are magnetic drive and the motor has no physical connection - there is no seal to go bad, etc.

They're basically bombproof unless they get wet from leaks or have some kind of electrical problem.

But - with it running all the time you can get nasties growing in there..... that's for sure.....

 

[Pascal]

i clean my AC strainer once a month or so in winter, every couple of month in winter where the pump doesn't run as much. In winter, the stuff in there doens't smell too good because it sits...

my seacock isn't frozen, it's just that it has a removable handle and it's a little harder to reach. since that side stuffing box leaks a little, the bilge is never dry anyway... so i dont' bother closing it eery time... i do close it once in a while to keep it free. also, mine doesn't have stops so it's hard to be sure when it's fully open ...

the scoop should prevent some stuff coming in but even with the scoop/screen i get a lot of stuff. when i clean it, it's usually 3/4 full of grass.

 

[Liquid Asset]

Angela, I feel your pain with the stuck sea valve. We replaced all of our thru hulls in March due to them not working or becoming hard to use. But after saying that, some of our new valves are stiff even though they are brand new. I had my buddy who can weld make me a cheater wrench. It is basically a t shaped piece of aluminum pipe that I can slip over the handle of the thru hull and make the handle "Longer" or at a 90 degree angle to give me some more leverage. My Navy buddy recomended it to me and said they have them in all the boats in the Navy. Possibly something like this woudl help you get your thru hull to close. I have to clean my strainer biweekly and put in Bromine tablets because of the soft growth here. We have some of the worst I have ever seen anywhere and if you go to long it gets in the entire system. I say you need to get the thru hull fixed, but you already know that.

 

[jim rosenthal]

You guys are braver than me, but I don't dive, and the cost of a haulout for a 36C is quite a bit less....I think if you drive wood plug into the through-hull first, you should be fine. Yes it will leak a bit but not much. That buys you some time to free up things inside. Mind you, if you are trying to free up the sea valve and it snaps off, your wood plug will not buy you much.

 

[Trojan]

Try putting a thin (key word) plastic bag over the input of the strainer. With any kind of water flow, water pressure should hold it on the strainer and stop the flow. For emergencies like large or small holes. I keep a large plastic tarp and 200ft. of 1/4 nylon line. You can tie the line to the tarp stretch it under your hull and secure it over the hole with the lines. Water pressure will hold it there over the hole along with the lines until you can get to a lift. Works best if the leading edge is kept above the water. Either way it works you just need to go slower if the leading edge is under water. You can try this on your strainer see if your flow stops. It works and is cheap.


BILL

 

[Angela]

Thank you, everyone, for all of the advice. The job is done, and I'm sitting back with an adult beverage now that it's over, BECAUSE I NEED IT! That was just terrifying to me with all that water running in. It truly made me weak in the knees and I was shaking like a leaf in the wind. I had all my gear laid out - tools, gaskets, rags, lights, scuba gear on the dock and "on" ready to go, bungs, plastic bag, etc. And I had a couple from down the dock, very experienced sailboaters, there to help. I have to admit that when I couldn't stop the flow of water, the man stepped in to take over. Looking back...the reason I could not stop the flow of water was because when I opened it and a bunch of gunk poured out, I put the cap back on right away, but for the crap still hanging out of it, I couldn't get it closed all the way. Well, duh...but in that situation, I just couldn't "see" that. Now that I've been through it, and I personally understand the flow rate and my pump's ability to keep up, I won't be so nervous. I figured if I laid out the scuba gear, all fired up and ready to splash, I wouldn't need. Cheap insurance.

At first, I could not find the basket in there - the handle was missing. When we did finally wrestle it out, the bottom was missing, presumable still in the bottom of the strainer. When I haul out to fix the seacock, I'll replace that strainer and keep the old one for spare parts. The strainer was a real mess inside - had a dead fish in there, but not a whole lot of grass. I could only recover one blade of sea grass from the bilge pump area.

What's amazing, to me anyway - I guess I'm easily impressed - is that the pump runs quietly now. Before we cleaned the strainer, it sounded like it had marbles in it, clattering very loudly. Hopefully, I got some of the gremlins out of the AC system today.

I've been eyeing this project for weeks now. I look at some, and go away and think about it. I go back and look at it some more from another angle, and ponder the process some more. This went on for weeks! Well, it's over and I'm relieved. And I gotta go through this once a month, Pascal??? My liquor cabinet isn't big enough for that. But seriously, it will be better for me next time since I have a real and personal experience with what it really is now. As the time went on with the water gushing into the bilge, I did seem to calm down some, even to the point where I went to find the camera to take a picture for Ed.

I know...you're thinking, gee what will she do in a real catastrophe? I don't know. I love this boat so much and I'm so afraid something will happen to her that will make me lose her that I just turn into a ball of nerves when something like this has to be done.

 

[Paul45c]

And I gotta go through this once a month, Pascal??? My liquor cabinet isn't big enough for that.

Sounds like you "done good," but it's no worries at all when you've got a functioning seacock to shut off. You can be downright leisurely cleaning out the sea strainer, and the glass/bronze strainer body it sits in.

 

[jim rosenthal]

Ang, you should congratulate yourself. Most people don't fix their own boats. You do. The learning curve is occasionally scary, but it does flatten out after a while- more or less. You've already fixed more things on your own boat than most people do in a lifetime.

One of the great things about a Hatteras is that since they used good quality hardware to begin with, generally when you fix something and maintain it, it
STAYS fixed. Not like some other things I own..(I won't mention one of my cars that appears to be on its SECOND set of rear window motors in 16,000 miles...)

As time goes on, it gets a little easier- the jobs don't, maybe, but your expertise grows and you realize that a lot of jobs are at least somewhat familiar because they contain elements of stuff you already did. None of us are any brighter than you and we've all done a lot of this stuff.

Plus, one of the nice things about owning a boat for a long time is that you can look at stuff you fixed a while back and see it still working. Of course, if it's been a long time, you can look at things and think "what moron did THAT?"...and then realize...it's you. Uh oh. But it shows you have progressed...after 15 years I have a few of those- things I wish I'd done differently, or have had to do over.

 

[Angela]

It's amzing what trouble a little dead fish in the sea strainer can stir up! I am running ALL seven air conditioners on the boat doing it on 40 amps; it took 50 amps and a prayer to do that before. What's more amazing is that I'm getting 51-55 degrees output now - a far cry from the 68-74 degrees I got before on a good day. The outflow of water through the hull is markedly stronger. None of the compressors or evaporators are giving me any back talk either, and I haven't even had to get out Magic Cane and shake at any of them. I think I just saved myself a ton of cash since I don't have to have that Cruisair tech come out pronto and start poking around!!

What I need now is a sweatshirt - it's getting mighty chilly in here.

Sanctuary and I are happy again.