white smoke on a cold day during 8V71 Detroit diesel engine start

[witold933252763]

Need to install block heaters on my Detroit 8V71 diesels.
Any help with where to install them and what heater elements to use will be greatly appreciated
Wit- 58' Yachtfisher.

 

[jim rosenthal]

Google Kim HotStarts...

 

[witold933252763]

Thanks Jim
Problem solved!

 

[Bob Quinn]

I don't know if that is the same company as Hotstart.com?
anyways, they seem pretty helpful, I'm trying to upgrade mine now.
I believe these two spots is one option on where to hook them in.
One is a heater, the other a temperature sensor.
I don't know if I like this setup as the sensor is very close to the heater, and I think I have read it should be on the opposite side of the motor.
Unless you are not using temp controlled units, then it probably doesn't have a sensor and that would be irrelevant.

This is where mine is currently hooked in.

 

[madhatter1]

I do building controls so have access to many sensors and controllers. This winter as part of my engine room upgrade I am going to add temp sensors and control to block heater circuits to keep the engines set at 90 degrees. Perfect temp for starting but not too warm. Hot temp control is for generators that need to start and switch to full load right away.

I'll post what I come up with. Will keep it very simple. Could come in handy for boats up north in the winter. If power goes out better to start with a block at 90 degrees than in the 30's or 40's. Thermal mass will give at least more time to get to the boat and take care of it.

 

[Captain Ralph]

I don't know if I like this setup as the sensor is very close to the heater, and I think I have read it should be on the opposite side of the motor.
This is where mine is currently hooked in.

I do question that installation. Don't think the rest of your engine ever gets any heat.
On our 12V71TI Detroits, the heater is down near the oil coolers and the thermostat is on the far water manifold,, THE other side of the engine.

I know your picture is a Detroit, just can not recognize the model. ??

 

[jim rosenthal]

I use Wolverine oil pan heaters on my Cummins diesels. So far, so good.

 

[RJM]

OK, I am currently getting ready to replace my block heaters on my 8V71N's. I've ordered two of these: Zeostart 3500043 engine block heaters from Amazon. The ones that I am replacing are located in the blocks, just above the alternators, on the right (facing) side of the blocks. I do have a question; how much coolant do I need to drain out to expose the heaters? Thanks.

 

[Captain Ralph]

OK, I am currently getting ready to replace my block heaters on my 8V71N's. I've ordered two of these: Zeostart 3500043 engine block heaters from Amazon. The ones that I am replacing are located in the blocks, just above the alternators, on the right (facing) side of the blocks. I do have a question; how much coolant do I need to drain out to expose the heaters? Thanks.

I am familiar with that install. Before you get into it, does your alternator mounting bracket allow access to that block plug? Many do not.
The bracket usually covers that plug.
The more common plug to use is on the other side, elbow from the oil cooler to the block. Nice plug there.

When installing and replacing my heaters, believe it or not, very little comes out. Pending how fast you are,, a pint maybe..
Do not open your expansion tank cap.
IMO not worth draining the system.

 

[RJM]

I am familiar with that install. Before you get into it, does your alternator mounting bracket allow access to that block plug? Many do not.
The bracket usually covers that plug.
The more common plug to use is on the other side, elbow from the oil cooler to the block. Nice plug there.

When installing and replacing my heaters, believe it or not, very little comes out. Pending how fast you are,, a pint maybe..
Do not open your expansion tank cap.
IMO not worth draining the system.

Thanks for the tip about not opening the expansion tank. That's good that there's not much loss. I have to replace both, which have given up the ghost. Here's a picture of the block heater that I am going to replace. I don't think that I am going to have a problem getting a wrench on it, Worse case, I remove the belts for access.

 

[Bob Quinn]

I do question that installation. Don't think the rest of your engine ever gets any heat.
On our 12V71TI Detroits, the heater is down near the oil coolers and the thermostat is on the far water manifold,, THE other side of the engine.

I know your picture is a Detroit, just can not recognize the model. ??

8v71ti's
Yeah I don't like the setup, the coolant tank ends up pretty hot, at least in the summer.
I think I might take a laser temp gun and see what the opposite side reads.
Ironically the setup on there has only a very short connection for the temp sensor. So a different cable setup would be needed.

 

[jmooney]

On my 12V71 block heater installation, the thermostat and the the heater are not far apart, the whole engine gets hot . The only thing to watch is that the thermostat housing is aluminum and can corrode away before the heat element. I think 5 years is about its life . Engines start so easily and virtually no smoke.

 

[Dan Mapes]

I am surprised about the need for block heaters in the summer. We were in Kingston NY and did not use them in the summer. The AC units along with the river water kept the bilge warm enough.

 

[Sadey]

I run our block heaters 24/7 during the season. Instant start with no smoke. As a bonus on cold mornings I’ll open the engine room doors for a little free heat. It’s amazing how much warmth is given off from these blocks.

 

[Bob Quinn]

I am surprised about the need for block heaters in the summer. We were in Kingston NY and did not use them in the summer. The AC units along with the river water kept the bilge warm enough.

I don't think they are necessarily needed in the summer.
Through our season in Michigan we see temps from mid 50's to upper 90's usually 75-80 highs in the summer and maybe 60-70's at night.

I have had smokie and non smokie start ups.

I am thinking of doing like Sadey does and leave them on all summer.
There is good evidence that much of engine wear happens during warm up and so block heaters can help extend engine life. At the least I am going to try to fire up the heaters an hour or two before starting the motors if possible. Sometimes in the summer we get pretty hot and I don't know if I would want the extra heat coming from the engine rooms 24/7 when we are running air conditioning full blast.

What would be really nice would be dual temp heaters. One lower temp for maintaining temp and warding off moisture, then high temp for pre-starting.

 

[Bob Quinn]

I do building controls so have access to many sensors and controllers. This winter as part of my engine room upgrade I am going to add temp sensors and control to block heater circuits to keep the engines set at 90 degrees. Perfect temp for starting but not too warm. Hot temp control is for generators that need to start and switch to full load right away.

I'll post what I come up with. Will keep it very simple. Could come in handy for boats up north in the winter. If power goes out better to start with a block at 90 degrees than in the 30's or 40's. Thermal mass will give at least more time to get to the boat and take care of it.

Would you have any suggestions to be able to have a dual temp capable system? Like lower temp for storage and moisture control and high temp for pre-starting?

 

[jmooney]

2-3 hours before start won’t do a lot. I run the heaters the night before starting the next day. If you are going to run every day , I don’t think that you need them as the engines are still warm the next morning, at least in Miami they are .

 

[Bob Quinn]

I use Wolverine oil pan heaters on my Cummins diesels. So far, so good.

This is probably better at preventing engine start up wear. After doing a little research I am wondering if maybe I would want both an oil heater and block heater.

If the numbers I am seeing are accurate that 75 to 90% of engine wear is due to cold starts/ cold oil / waiting for oil pump to pump oil, then this could be a good way to extend engine life at a very low cost.

 

[Sadey]

Running ours 24/7 is a trap for errors caused by my CRS disease. Can’t Remember Shit. This prevents forgetting to turn them on the night before a trip.