VF Head installation cost?

[Bill Root]

My last question regarding best head system received some great response. Obviously folks are passionate about their favorites. I think I'm moving toward VF. The boat currently has three Galley Maids. What should I budget to have a VF system installed to replace the GM's? Thanks.

 

[Angela]

Is installing it yourself out of the question?

Reason I ask - not that I particularly enjoy that kind of work, but I enjoy that kind of work...for the main reason that I learn a whole lot about the system by doing it myself which is helpful when I have to do maintenance on it such as replace the duckbills every five years or so, and I also gain a full understanding of how and why the system works like it does; not just the VF, but pretty much anything on this boat that needs to be done. When I did my VF installation, I also chose to re-hose the entire boat - NOT FUN - but I'm glad I did it as my hoses were the originals. At least on Sanctuary, I can tell anyone just about anything about this boat and where everything is and how it works - I learned all of that by doing things like installing VF myself.

Now that I have that education under my belt, I'd love to let someone else do it next time! LOL

 

[Bill Root]

Ang:

Doing it myself is NOT out of the question. Like you, I kind of enjoy it, as long as my ageing body can get into where I have to get to. Those spaces seem to get smaller every year. I do have other things to get done though, so wanted to get an idea of what installing cost would be. Then I could decide how much I would save by doing it myself.

 

[REBrueckner]

I don't know how much installation is, but its a LOT of work...will be very time consuming....a good winter/off season job....just make a detailed list of what has to be done...new hoses, new wiring, extra circuit breakers(?), location of vacuum unit, cosmetic alterations in each head if new toilets don't cover the old toilet footprint, fresh water supply routing(?), space for hoses and vacuum unit...wow big job in small spaces....how to treat old seacocks??? Do you need old hose removed?? is it fastened in place....can you leave old hose in place and have sufficient room to run new hose???? Do you know where "duct" space is in your boat....bilge ok for hose, not for wires....

A compromise might be for you to do the removal of the old system, and maybe, say, run all the new wiring, maybe wire the electric panel end, maybe run hoses too, so your mechanic/installer can just put new stuff together... on the other hand, that's perhaps the "fun" part....

 

[saltshaker]

You may not be able to do it yourself. I looked into it a few years ago. I could not find a dealer to sell me the units without installation. I called Sealand and they told me the systems are only available from an installer. A friend of mine found a dealer in the mid west who sold him the systems. That dealer lost his dealership with Sealand for selling their system direct to the consumer. Maybe things have changed and maybe your local dealer will sell you the components, but we can't get them here in NJ/NY.

 

[richard collette]

Hi--I just put in a new Raritan treat and hold system to replace the original Lectra-San with a Electro-San. It works well and fits very compact near the fuel shut-offs. Not cheap but after looking at the rest found it to be the best for me. I have wholesale accounts which would help some if you'd like.
Good luck!!

 

[Angela]

I could not find a dealer to sell me the units without installation. I called Sealand and they told me the systems are only available from an installer.

They TRIED to tell me that too, but I'm stubborn and that sounded like a bunch of BS to me. The local distributor here even insulted me with his comments that this really wasn't a job for "someone like me." What did he know about "me"??? I was talking to him over the phone trying to get a price on a component I needed. He told me I would be best to leave this up to the professionals, and with that comment, he did nothing but motivate me.

I bought two complete VF systems from Sailorman (new, still in the box, but on consignment), and the third stytem from my local marine store where I have a wholesale account - everything I needed. You can also buy some stuff online - it's there; it's available, but you've got to get past the BS. What I didn't have were the installation instructions. I contacted Sealand and they emailed it to me.

When I was purchasing the system, Sealand told me that they would not warranty "the system." I asked if there was a warranty on the motor I was buying - yes. Is there a warranty on the tank I'm buying - yes. Is there a warranty on the the toilet I'm buying - yes. OK, then who cares if they won't provide warranty on the "system." If a pump fails before the warranty period on the pump expires, I take it out and get another one; if a tank cracks or a vac switch goes bad within the warranty period, I take it out and get another one. I guess what they won't warrant is the something like a vac leak since they didn't install it. I'm OK with that - I'll fix my own stuff like that anyway.

I installed my VF systems myself from scratch, and I whole-heartedly believe I did as good a job as any "professional." I have no leaks, not one problem in two years so far, and no cycling of the pumps unless they are being flushed.

 

[Genesis]

They're just trying to protect their dealer's market, and it's a royal crock.

The VF systems are far easier to deal with than anything else I've ever used, and I've had or had to work on most marine head products. You couldn't GIVE me most others.

 

[Bill Root]

More good info. Thank you.

 

[egaito]

I don't know how much installation is, but its a LOT of work...will be very time consuming....

Good points, but I think this makes the job sound a bit bigger than it really is......we used the GM 32v feeds to power a converter for the units we found on a deal. The units were mounted near the old GM pumps, so power was there. The GM's draw much more amperage than the VF's, so even with conversion losses, there's plenty of power. No new breakers, and minimal wiring.

Hoses needed to be done, well, because it was time. Otherwise, the original hoses and thru-hulls would have worked fine without modification. We took the opportunity to completely eliminate the overboard discharge....flushing a pint (plus the human contribution) at a time, there is no reason not to just go directly to the tank.

Fresh water can be tapped from a nearby faucet or shower. Not a long run as every head has both a sink and shower nearby.

There are a couple of ways the units come "packaged". We ended up with two that integrated the vacuum tank and pump into a single unit. It's a setup that was designed for easy OEM installation. Screw it down somewhere, hook up the input and output hoses, feed it DC, and you're done.

For tighter installations, Misty is one, there is a bullet shaped vacuum tank hosed to the toilet, which is in turn hosed to the pump, and then to the waste tank run. A bit more complex, but designed for maximum flexibility for tight spaces.

There is definitely work involved, but it's not necessarily a complete refit, and it's not very complex.

 

[sgharford]

Hey Bill, I have vacu flush heads installed on my 43DC. PM me your email and I'll take a couple of pictures of where prev owner installed components. Kind of funny - they didn't know about the 4th unused 'mystery tank' in between the engines. They installed a 5th tank under floor in V-berth. I'm very happy about this as no hoses and fittings to crawl over in engine space.

 

[Will]

We have a 1980 43' DC with two VC toilets. Each has its own JW series vacuum pump/tank. The vacuum pump/tank for the aft head is mounted outboard of the aft end of the starboard main engine with a hose routed on the outboard side of the inboard SME engine stringer to a "Tee" on the forward most, OEM center line tank. The vacuum pump/tank for the fwd head is mounted center line just forward of the fwd head shower sump (in the fwd cabin) with the hose going to the same "Tee" as the aft head. Both vacuum pumps are connected to the original head 12 volt power sources.
Will