Survey Day

[Capt Ratty]

Just had a survey done on a 1968 41 ft Hatt with 653 engs. Now a couple of questions for you people out there that have had some experience with some older Hatts. Took a short sea trial running at 1300 rpm. Oil pressure at 35 lbs.
Picked up the pace to wot for only a few minutes, slowed for a u turn, eng at 1300 once again. Oil pressure down to 10 lbs, than increasing to 25 lbs or so.
This sounds like trouble in the near future to me. Comments?

 

[Nonchalant1]

If the drop was short term, it's probably nothing, but if the 10 lb reading was accurate and persisted, it's not a good sign. I'm not familiar with 6V53s but normally oil pressure's biggest variables are just engine speed and oil temp. The oil pres drops temporarlly when you slow, but after the engine is stabilized at 1300 is should be similar for similar operating temps. If the oil was cold at first, it'll have high pressure until it warms. Also, if you were watching electric gauges at the helm, you need to do it and watch the manual gauges in the ER.

Doug

 

[StratPlan61]

I agree with everything Doug says in his comment and would add one other thought. When you 'rev' the motor while in neutral for a quick 1-2 second 'rev', the oil pressure should remain pretty constant, 35-40psi without a significant increase or drop in oil pressure. If it varies significantly I would be aprehensive about it.

Bear'
1984 61' MY Strategic Plan

 

[ThirdHatt]

Once good and warm (after the first run of 1300rpm) the oil pressure AT IDLE can be at or just below 10psi. Sometimes Murphy alarms will sound after the engines are running and fully warm and the hrottles are returned to idle. Did the pressure drop while turning around, at idle? If you were at 10psi while at 1300rpm, I could be concerned.

 

[yachtsmanbill]

Somewhere I read that DD oil pressure minimums are 1-3 lb of oil pressure for each 100 rpm. I ran mine 120 miles and at 1500 rpm had 35#s OP. At idle they were down to about 12-14. I almost panicked but they maintained that consistently.
Although the gauge drops fast, increase has a substantial lag-- maybe 30 seconds. They are mechanical gauges no?? These are dinosaurs anyway. Keep oil in them, and dont feel the need to run WOT. A man will walk on mars before they crap out!! ws

 

[Capt Ratty]

Thanks guys for all the feedback on oil pressure.
How concerned should I be about soft spots on deck? Also water damage at all windows and ports. Wood is mush under several windows about 1 inch down the walls
Thanks for your help.

 

[jim rosenthal]

Concerned enough to try to get an idea what it will cost you to fix those areas (aim high on your estimates- it's the "while you're in theres" that get you) and have the price adjusted accordingly. Neither of these jobs are impossible- but replacing bad deck core is time-consuming and not particularly cheap, and removing the windows, repairing the damage, and replacing the frames is certainoy not cheap either. Mind you, I would not let this stuff scare you off a boat you like. Any 1965 boat is going to require repair unless someone else just did it all. Try to make sure, however, that the price of the boat realistically reflects what the surveyor found.

 

[34Hatt]

Try to make sure, however, that the price of the boat realistically reflects what the surveyor found.

This is very good suggestion.
If you can feel that the deck is soft by walking on it there is going to be a lot that needs to be replaced are you VERY HANDY??? Paying some one will be expensive and it is hard to judge how much needs to be replaced with out cutting into it.
Good luck let us know how you make out.

 

[REBrueckner]

Your surveyor did an "el cheapo" survey (for him) if he did not follow up soft deck spots with a moisture meter check. Without a check via moisture meter, the work required may be far more extensive than you think.

If you are able and willing to do such work yourself, that's one thing because likely well over 3/4 of the cost will be labor. But if you have to pay for all of it, and want it repainted after the repairs, get ready for a potentially whopping sized bill.

 

[REBrueckner]

By the way, I should have mentioned I had 6V53's in a 42 ft Matthews for 22 years. The only "repairs" I had done to them during that time was replacement of a governor bearing and injector rebuilds.

Did you consider an oil analysis?

I loved the engines, but they are noisey...more so than the 8V71TI's I now run. On the other hand, that "whine" was always appealing to me. If you run them at 2,000 or 2,100 (vs rated top of 2,800 PM) they'll last a long/long/long time.

You have to check the hand hole access plates periodically because the cork gaskets slip and slide and have to be replaced every few years. When they move and leak, you get a lot of smoke out the exhaust...no big deal.

Also, if the boat has Borg Warner transmissions, be sure to have the transmission oil coolers (on the engines) cleaned if they haven't been. Friction plate debris can clog the coolers and cause oil overheating and failure. After I had that happen to me, I added transmission oil temperature gauges and also added them on my current Hatteras. If debris is found, likely the plates need to be replaced.

Good luck.

 

[akintosyali]

I have a 1965 41' DC. Replaced all wood paneling underneath the windows. the contractor replaced the shelves, and built more storage space for me as well. The cost was about $3K. Fixing the soft spots requires a much more skilled labor. If it is not going to get done right - do not do it at all.

Can not comment on the engines. I have Chrysler 426 wedge engines, and they are more depandable than anything I ever saw.

 

[hunshatt]

The "coring" is probably plywood. If you've got just a bit of skill, or have friends that do, a deck patch and re glass isn't a big deal, ar redeck isn't even sll that tuff. the damage below the windows isn't really a problem either, unless you want to maintain originality, then finding the correct vennere will be a PIA. You need to determine what your skills are, and what level of finish you need to be happy. Me I'm ok with b level work. I come from a racing back ground and learned long ago you've got to be at the start line to win the race. Very little was"perfect" but it ran, and well. Same applies to boats, I've got friends who spent years and years on the hard thinking and rethinking as well as doing and redoing so everything was just so. Years that they , in retrospect, wish they had been in the water and running the boat.
Just my perspective.
Tim

 

[Capt Ratty]

Thanks again guys for the follow up on the soft spots.
The surveyor was very good, He used a moister meter on all the decks. The meter was pinned around the cleats, stanchion posts, and mast mounting area.
The worst spot was near the water fill on the forward port catwalk. Soft under foot and could be seen visably to compress by at least 1/4 to 3/8 of an inch.
As for the eng's max rpm, it would not crank up to 2800. I don't recall what it was, but when I get the report back I'll check. Top speed was about 16 knots.
Transmissions showed some slippage.

 

[jim rosenthal]

Sounds like some "adjustments" are in order. Frankly, I would rather have the price lowered and then fix things on my own later than have the seller fix anything. You get into troublesome areas when you ask someone to warranty that which was done for a prior owner- not realistic, IMHO. Better to get the boat for cheaper, then after the purchase, get bids and take your chances.

 

[Capt Ratty]

All good advice. Owner is out of state. A don't wanna. We'll see.
Thanks for everything.

 

[Trojan]

Boy I sure agree with Jim. I have seen some of the work done by the seller just to get something fixed in order to get a sale. Not good. Better to purchase it at a reduced price than to have the seller have it fixed by some cobbler. You will at least have a chance at getting it done correct.
I have yet to see a moister meter that was worth a damn. They will tell you if it just rained.

BILL

 

[hunshatt]

I thought when you said "deck" you ment the cockpit sole. If its the forward decking, I haven't a clue, so disregard my rambleing.
The speed seems close though.

 

[yachtsmanbill]

Hey AKIN-- whats your carpenters name?? I know a bunch of guys that work out of Pier 11. Dale on JERRY M III sez hi! Bill HATT TRICK