Rudder Post, good or bad luck

[Top Shelf]

Well after a week on the hard the travel lift is putting the boat in the well, I do the preflight, yard guy is checking the rudder stuffing boxes. He says the stb side is leaking pretty badly. I hand him a 3/4" wrench and head up to the office to leave my firstborn. As I'm writing the check the Project Manager comes in says "bad news" one for the adjusting studs broke off. Sure enough he's holding a piece of 3/8" threaded bronze with a 3/4" nut on it.

Long story short, we can't get the stub out of cast flange bolted against the hull. So the boat goes back on the blocks...cha ching......

So I guess I'm lucky this didn't happen over in the Bahamas....anyway I go down to the yard today and try every trick I know, including jam nuts, a little heat, PB Blaster, hammer, swearing and bleeding. It ain't moving and the vice grips are boogering up the threads.

So Monday I guess the drill is to drop the rudder, to where we can get a "reversing thread socket" on it. If that doesn't work; it seems that whole dang flang will need to come out....cha ching again.

Anybody run into this before? Any trick that I may have over looked? Thx.

 

[Finalee]

Not sure what your access looks like. More heat would likely do it. Again ya gotta be carefull with it.

 

[MikeP]

Yeah - the trusty "Flame Wrench" (oxy-acetylene - not some pretend-torch) is the ultimate weapon for heating seized bolts/nuts/fittings, etc sufficiently to ensure removal. Of course one has to be concerned about the flammability of the surrounding material...

 

[yachtsmanbill]

Stupid question... did the yard send an ace mechanic down to adjust the packing and inadvertantly tighten the rudder post mounting bolts? Mine are 3/4" and the engine packing nuts are 15/16". It sounds like he busted a carriage bolt. (?) ws

 

[Top Shelf]

I think I would of done the same thing if I had tried tighten them. My rudders look like what you're showing in the bottom picture. Only difference is there is one nut on top of the flange and one below it (evidently to push the flange up for packing changes).

I'll try a little more heat tomorrow, but I'm really nervous about getting to much heat against that hull glass. Thanks for the inputs.

 

[yachtsmanbill]

If its that close. wrap some tin foil or wet rags around the post. It'll take a lot of flame to hurt 1" + FG. Is that an OEM setup? ws

 

[REBrueckner]

Am I losing it entirely??? or is this a SHAFT packing, not a rudder packing issue, with 3/4 or so nuts involved..the bottom of the two photos...The rudder packing is the huge inverted 3 1/2" or so nut...

Too late now, but when adjusting ANY packing, always back off the nuts first, grease the threads with something like waterpump grease.....then snug up...unless you have corrosion, which you SHOULD check by inspecting the break, a little grease will prevent this kind of unfortunate hassle...

Corrosion will appear as imperfection voids and a reddish color at the break...

Also regarding the lower photo, I ALWAYS install hose clamps, which look sooo good, with the thread side UP...on top...so when drips occur and water runs down, it's not corroding the tightening/thread mechanism...no big deal, but why not avoid such an issue...

 

[yachtsmanbill]

Hey REB... I dont get it either (?). It sounds like the guy tried to tighten the gland base to the hull.
FWIW; the view is from the top. The clamp studs are at about the 10 O'clock position with the threads pointed down so that you dont snag a knee or pants when "straining" around that area. ws

 

[Top Shelf]

No, sorry. what I'm trying to say is that my rudder posts and packing gland have that eliptical shaped flange or insert with the two threaded studs and 3/4" nuts on them. Not that one big hex head set up. Just like the lower photo (I realize that's a shaft, not rudder post). The threaded rods thread into a casting that bolts to the hull. I'll try to post some pix. Thx.

 

[Top Shelf]

Well, every dog has his day and today was mine I guess. I got pretty lucky, I pulled out my live well and that allowed me to better postion myself and really put a much better bite on it with vise grips. 2 days of PB blaster helped I'm sure and after a couple of wraps with a hammer, got it to move. Finally backed ot all the way out. Here's the pix. Thx.

 

[yachtsmanbill]

Well I'll be dipped in doggy doo doo!!! Ive seen glands like that on tugs etc., but not on a yacht(?). Is the base cast iron or is that just the mungoo/corrosion on it? What ever it is, it needs a bunch of cleaning... thats for sure! Make sure you run a tap through those threads and use lots never sieze when you re-assemble it. You should probably do both while youre at it...
FWIW... I would try he DeGulis cleaning method. BRUSH only, some muriatic acid on the whole thing, rinse well, then wire brush it. THEN neutralize it with some baking soda. ws

 

[yachtsmanbill]

Was there two or four studs on the gland? It looks like the offending one is right next to that 2X4. ws

 

[Top Shelf]

No the whole deal is cast bronze. It was actually the one on the other side of the 2X4 that broke. But I agree needs some serious clean up. Thx.

 

[Genesis]

Same rudder glands I had on Gigabite. Hatteras used some good stuff on these boats. I always kept a second nut on the bottom to jack up the sleeve for packing changes - makes life much easier.

I love those packing glands - the "big nut" ones suck monkey balls in my experience, while these are just plain NICE. Mine were the same design on both the shafts and rudders.

 

[spartonboat1]

Well I'll be dipped in doggy doo doo!!! Ive seen glands like that on tugs etc., but not on a yacht(?). Is the base cast iron or is that just the mungoo/corrosion on it? What ever it is, it needs a bunch of cleaning... thats for sure! Make sure you run a tap through those threads and use lots never sieze when you re-assemble it. You should probably do both while youre at it...
FWIW... I would try he DeGulis cleaning method. BRUSH only, some muriatic acid on the whole thing, rinse well, then wire brush it. THEN neutralize it with some baking soda. ws

Not only beautifully cleaned up, but check out the T clamps...

 

[spartonboat1]

Well, every dog has his day and today was mine I guess. I got pretty lucky, I pulled out my live well and that allowed me to better postion myself and really put a much better bite on it with vise grips. 2 days of PB blaster helped I'm sure and after a couple of wraps with a hammer, got it to move. Finally backed ot all the way out. Here's the pix. Thx.

Outstanding bruddah Hatt owner...as one of my teachers used to say, got to get the emphahh sis on the right sylaaaah bull! Good deal...bet you're a happy camper (guess you said that)...

 

[fissioneng]

Small hijack. I have the same 2 stud rudder packing gland. How many packing rings do you put in?

I am changing mine, (I think original) and I pulled 4 rings out yesterday. The nuts were right at the top of the studs. The Hatteras drawing I have shows 3 rings. My packing is 1/2", so I am guessing Hatteras recommends 1.5" of packing. My shaft packing is 3/8" and the drawing shows 4 rings or 1.5".

 

[Genesis]

3 rings every time I did mine.