Need An Anchoring Expert

[Avenger]

I posted this across the hall hoping for some knowledgeable advice, but those guys just keep jerking my chain (no pun intended).

Last night we went fishing near a bridge and had to anchor in some fast current in order to get our correct position near the bridge. It took several tries to get the hook to set. Then when it was time to leave we had some serious trouble getting the anchor loose.

Generally the bottom around here is sand or sometimes clay, and a Danforth seems to be the popular hook for the region. Usually we don't have trouble, but we don't usually anchor in that kind of current.

The anchor is a 22 lb. West Marine Danforth knockoff with about 8 ft of 1/4" chain. Anybody have any ideas why I'm having so much trouble with this thing?

I've attached a picture of the anchor after we retrieved it so maybe you guys can see a reason why we're having so many problems.


Thoughts?

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[Pascal]

1)- danforth knock offs are not danforths... get a high tensile danforth or better in my opinion a Fortress.
2)- not enough chain... if not all chain, go at least for 40 or 50' which will give you a lot more weight and drag on the bottom, helping the anchor to set.
3)- in a swift current, make sure you slow the boat with the engines as you pay out scope. I always try to keep my drift under 1kt while setting. otherwise, the anchor just drags on the bottom

clearly, judging by the pix, once you got it to set, it held!

the most common mistake i see (beside small anchors) are not enough scope AND too much speed while setting.

probalby wouldnt' hurt to upsize the anchor as well...

I anchor out a lot and never have a problem.

 

[Finalee]

That anchor had to have been caught on an underwater ubstruction for that to have occurred. Luckily the pulpit was not damaged!

 

[Passages]

The anchor is a 22 lb. West Marine Danforth knockoff with about 8 ft of 1/4" chain. Anybody have any ideas why I'm having so much trouble with this thing?

I've attached a picture of the anchor after we retrieved it so maybe you guys can see a reason why we're having so many problems.


Thoughts?

[/

Pascal is correct. The West Marine knockoff is not a true Danforth . If you look closely, you'll see a slight twist in the shaft which is absent in the originals.

I can only guess the modified design is intended to provide greater hooking capability when drifting in fast current or using the anchor to tie off to a shoreside tree in true redneck fashion.

As your experience can attest, this modified design provided exceptional holding power. I think you're on to something and should similarily modify all your "Danforth-like" anchors to achieve the superior results.

 

[Jaxfishgyd]

It's made that way so you don't know if your coming or going.

 

[rsmith]

Looks like the kind of thing that happens when you anchor on a wreck. I've been using a grapnel with a trip line for wreck fishing. Works for coral and rocks too.
If you anchored near a bridge there is usaly a lot of rebar and crap they throw in the water around the bridge. Its one of the things that attracts the fish to the bridge area.

 

[SKYCHENEY]

Sometimes there are also the remnants of a previous bridge near the location. Could have been caught on an old piling or other debris.

To set that anchor now, you will need to spin the boat rapidly in a clockwise direction as you deploy it. Adds a whole new dimension to anchoring.

 

[Avenger]

Boy, I can't get nuttin' past youze guys.

We tried three sets before we got one to hook up, then we were in the wrong position so we tried again. The windlasses (Mike and Artie) thought we needed to set the anchor closer to the center of the channel. I disagreed, but since they were doing all the heaving and hoisting I let them pick the spot. She hooked up but we ended up in the navigation channel. That's when the fun started.

Keep in mind, the current is hauling @$$ through here, 5 - 6 kts at least. I have seen boats trying to hold station while lowering the anchor suck the rode into the prop. Bad enough in the lee of the bridge. Very bad uptide of it. Especially if you need to hit the span dead center if you ever want to use the RADAR again. Combine that with the fact that there's boats around us it was about impossible to go wide past the anchor and I was very afraid of getting the rode in the props.

So all we can do is pivot around in different directions to try to break it loose. At one point the boat took a very weird lurch but still remained hooked. We were starting to let out line to try to get it to a stern cleat when I noticed we were getting closer to the bridge faster than the guys were letting out line. She was free and as soon as I heard chain hit the chute I goosed it away from the bridge. I'm assuming the lurch was when the shank bent, pulling from 90º is probably what allowed the anchor to get off the snag.

The funny part... We reset it in the spot that I picked, hooked up right away and fished for the rest of the night! We didn't realize we had pretzeled the hook until we left.

This particular bridge had been a fixed bridge, which was ripped out and replaced with a drawbridge. You're all right about construction debris. In the past we've pulled up structural steel pieces and similar on the anchor of my friend's boat. Most of that was on the other side where the temporary bridge had been built. However, the construction barges were mostly set up on the side we got caught on. I think they dropped a crane off of one.

There was another boat on the other end of the draw that must have tried twenty times to set his hook before finally finding purchase. Guess what he found! When he went to leave he was jammed up on the same thing. At least we got our anchor back. He ended up cutting his off. If the current wasn't screaming through there I'll bet a diver could do a good business.

 

[Avenger]

1)- danforth knock offs are not danforths...

Amen!

2)- not enough chain... if not all chain, go at least for 40 or 50' which will give you a lot more weight and drag on the bottom, helping the anchor to set.

Can't do it. Without a windlass the configuration is such that all the chain has to stay on deck. I may look into heavier chain.

3)- in a swift current, make sure you slow the boat with the engines as you pay out scope. I always try to keep my drift under 1kt while setting. otherwise, the anchor just drags on the bottom

As in the previous post, not taking the chance.

clearly, judging by the pix, once you got it to set, it held!

the most common mistake i see (beside small anchors) are not enough scope AND too much speed while setting.

probalby wouldnt' hurt to upsize the anchor as well...

The boat is 36 ft and weighs about 20 - 25 K lbs. I think the POS on there now is 22 lb, but it might be smaller. How big would you suggest?

 

[Avenger]

That anchor had to have been caught on an underwater ubstruction for that to have occurred. Luckily the pulpit was not damaged!

We were actually very surprised that the rode didn't let go. I was planning on getting a Slane pulpit, since this one looks like a diving board up there. Seems to be a lot stronger than I thought though.

 

[Northcott]

Simply not enough chain...

 

[Avenger]

I guess with enough chain I wouldn't need an anchor at all. Of course, that much chain would sink the boat.

My setup has the mooring bit with a hole in the back of it which leads the rode to the rope locker. There's no way to get chain through it, and leaving it unsecured on the deck doesn't work, so the best I can do with chain length is from the anchor, around the bit and back to the anchor and secure it with a snap hook. That works out to about 8 ft. I guess I could get heavier chain. OTOH, if this is how these things go I think I'll keep the cheap hardware up there for now. It's less heartbreaking to loose a $30 anchor than a $100 one.

When I replace the pulpit (someday) I'll put a chain stop on it. Of course, by the time I tackle that I'll probably be putting in a windlass too. I'd rather listen to a motor's whining than the crew's.

And BTW, for those that haven't said it, but I know are thinking it.... the cable crossing is on the other side of the bridge.

 

[Tim Powell]

I know i am going to catch some crap about this but nobody is going to get a cherry.(Randy)!
The anchor grabed and you got sideways of the grab.Then put pressure on the bar at a 45 or grater and bent it . We trout fish in the surf on a skiff letting the wind blow us onto the edge of the brakers casting to the beach . Quite often we bend a anchor because a wave turns us sideways and jerks.We made one made of stanless problem solved. (true there is somthing to be said about the knock off frankely they are not worth purchasing) TIM

 

[hatteras 1985]

Usually when Danforth-type anchors come up mangled, they snag a stray rock or coral head. I had a hell of a time pulling up a Fortress 70lb anchor a couple years ago off of Bimini. Once it reached the surface one of the flukes was bent at a 90 degree angle.

 

[Avenger]

Well, this started off tongue-in-cheek but there's no harm in discussion. You're all right, it was some kind of construction debris. Judging by the forces involved and the fact that a boat on the other side of the channel lost his anchor on the same thing it seems like they lost a crane over there. We had to do a lot of gyrating around the anchor before we finally got it back and I think bending it may be why we broke it out instead of cutting it off.

I finally took the anchor off the boat today. The shank is 1/2" steel plate. Knockoff or not, it took some force to do that.

We're going to try to straighten it. I'll let you know how we make out.

 

[mike]

FWIW, get this book " The Complete book of Anchoring & Mooring" 2nd edition by Earl R. Hinz (ISBN 0-87033-539-1) _ Cornell Maritime Press). It will take the mystery out of the process; and as already mentioned by others, bigger is better and more chain is better.

 

[Tim Powell]

Well, this started off tongue-in-cheek but there's no harm in discussion. You're all right, it was some kind of construction debris. Judging by the forces involved and the fact that a boat on the other side of the channel lost his anchor on the same thing it seems like they lost a crane over there. We had to do a lot of gyrating around the anchor before we finally got it back and I think bending it may be why we broke it out instead of cutting it off.

I finally took the anchor off the boat today. The shank is 3/8" steel plate. Knockoff or not, it took some force to do that.

We're going to try to straighten it. I'll let you know how we make out.

If like the smaller ones it will straiten but will bend easer the next time/ tim

 

[krush]

It'll be stronger, but more brittle...."work hardening"

 

[rsmith]

It'll be stronger, but more brittle...."work hardening"

SSSSSSSSSSSNAP!!!!!

 

[Avenger]

I'd doubt if putting a pipe on it is going to straighten it, even with two people leaning on it. Most likely the oxy-acetylene bender is coming out. It'll be annealed when we're done.