Material found in Gearbox Screen and Hydreco Pump question

[Jasper]

New gearbox issues to solve.
I have just repaired the port Allison Gearbox, so I was checking the starboard gearbox oil and found the oil was aerated.

Then checked the screen/filter and the hose to see if it may be sucking in air and found metal filing behind the screen.
After the panic had settled I had a good look at the filings. This could be wishful thinking but they may be from left over drill filings. They certainly look like it.
Maybe the person who replaced the rear engine seal drilled the metal part of the seal to remove it and left some drill waste to get sucked into the screen? The filings look similar to the ones I carefully cleaned out of the port side when I had to use a drill to break the old seal.

Now back to the aerated gearbox oil.
Looking at the stbd Hydreco oil pressure pump I think it may need a rebuild. I also would like to have a spare pump on board.
So any advice on where I can get a rebuilt Hydreco oil pressure pump?
Thanks.

 

[mike]

Acadian Marine Transmission, inc.
217 Burgess Drive
Broussard, LA 70518
Phone: (337) 837-3636
Fax: (337) 837-3633

acadianmarinetransmission.com


Best source for all Allison Marine transmissions parts and service. Nice people and prices are very fair, esp when compared to DD.

 

[MikeP]

When you say it looks like it needs a rebuild - what do you base that on. Do you have manual tranny pressure gauges? If so, what do they show? Can you adjust the pressure to be per specs as stated in the tranny manual? If so, the pump is fine. If not, the pumps are not difficult at all to rebuild - Acadian has the rebuild kits. It will probably take longer to remove the pump then it will to do the rebuild! But, as noted, Acadian is the place if you don't care to DIY it.

Though I wouldn't arguer strongly against carrying whatever spare parts you are comfortable with, personally, this is not one I would bother with. There really isn't much there to fail but we all do whatever we are personally comfortable doing.

Re aeration - any chance the tranny is overfull? That will also cause aeration.

Re the filings - I agree that from the pics that they look like drill filings- they certainly don't appear to be "tranny" debris. I am sure you were very careful with drilling out the seal but there are seal pullers to do that job without any risk of the damage that can result from errant filings.

 

[Jasper]

When you say it looks like it needs a rebuild - what do you base that on. Do you have manual tranny pressure gauges? If so, what do they show? Can you adjust the pressure to be per specs as stated in the tranny manual? If so, the pump is fine. If not, the pumps are not difficult at all to rebuild - Acadian has the rebuild kits. It will probably take longer to remove the pump then it will to do the rebuild! But, as noted, Acadian is the place if you don't care to DIY it.

Though I wouldn't arguer strongly against carrying whatever spare parts you are comfortable with, personally, this is not one I would bother with. There really isn't much there to fail but we all do whatever we are personally comfortable doing.

Re aeration - any chance the tranny is overfull? That will also cause aeration.

Re the filings - I agree that from the pics that they look like drill filings- they certainly don't appear to be "tranny" debris. I am sure you were very careful with drilling out the seal but there are seal pullers to do that job without any risk of the damage that can result from errant filings.

Hi Mike,
Thanks for the reply.The reason I think the Hydreco needs a rebuid is due to the aeration, plus there is oil around the base of the pump.
The pressure is good and operation of the gearbox is fine.....so far!
I suppose after going through all the hassle on the port side, I am thinking that the next problem may well be the stbd Hydreco and gearbox. I hope you and I are right about the drill filings. I am certain I left none when I did the port side, but who knows what happened when the stbd was done.
I will check the level of the oil in the GB, maybe that is the issue.
Thanks again.

 

[RT46]

foam can be from over or under the spec gear oil amount.

did you recently change the oil or filter?

you could also have a leak on the suction side of the pump

you do need to address and correct the condition or the gear will fail because the foammy oil cant cool the gear efficiently.

ck the pressure and temp with a mechanical gague

maybe send out oil samples?

i have no idea what that debris is.

good luck

 

[Jasper]

foam can be from over or under the spec gear oil amount.

did you recently change the oil or filter?

you could also have a leak on the suction side of the pump

you do need to address and correct the condition or the gear will fail because the foammy oil cant cool the gear efficiently.

ck the pressure and temp with a mechanical gague

maybe send out oil samples?

i have no idea what that debris is.

good luck

Hi RT46,
The oil and oil filter were changed about 50 hours ago.
I will change it again this week.
Thanks.

 

[Jasper]

When you say it looks like it needs a rebuild - what do you base that on. Do you have manual tranny pressure gauges? If so, what do they show? Can you adjust the pressure to be per specs as stated in the tranny manual? If so, the pump is fine. If not, the pumps are not difficult at all to rebuild - Acadian has the rebuild kits. It will probably take longer to remove the pump then it will to do the rebuild! But, as noted, Acadian is the place if you don't care to DIY it.

Though I wouldn't arguer strongly against carrying whatever spare parts you are comfortable with, personally, this is not one I would bother with. There really isn't much there to fail but we all do whatever we are personally comfortable doing.

Re aeration - any chance the tranny is overfull? That will also cause aeration.

Re the filings - I agree that from the pics that they look like drill filings- they certainly don't appear to be "tranny" debris. I am sure you were very careful with drilling out the seal but there are seal pullers to do that job without any risk of the damage that can result from errant filings.

I have sent an email to Acadian and await their response.
I'll post the next stage.
Thanks to all.

 

[saltshaker]

With the Allison M gears, the port gears are more prone to failure than the starboard. There was a bearing issue that once addressed will fix this. If the gears were never rebuilt before, they probably had the old bearings. Like others have said, aeration is usually from a leak in the suction side or over/under filling of oil. I doubt it's the pump or a problem with the gear. You should give Tom Slane a call. I don't remember the exact details, but when he bought that boat the shafts were removed and at least one of the gears was off the engine. I believe one was missing when he got the boat. The PO was looking to go to a deeper reduction gear to try and gain some speed. That starboard gear may have been gone through already, but that was a while ago.

 

[ron6785]

New gearbox issues to solve.
I have just repaired the port Allison Gearbox, so I was checking the starboard gearbox oil and found the oil was aerated.

Then checked the screen/filter and the hose to see if it may be sucking in air and found metal filing behind the screen.
After the panic had settled I had a good look at the filings. This could be wishful thinking but they may be from left over drill filings. They certainly look like it.
Maybe the person who replaced the rear engine seal drilled the metal part of the seal to remove it and left some drill waste to get sucked into the screen? The filings look similar to the ones I carefully cleaned out of the port side when I had to use a drill to break the old seal.

Now back to the aerated gearbox oil.
Looking at the stbd Hydreco oil pressure pump I think it may need a rebuild. I also would like to have a spare pump on board.
So any advice on where I can get a rebuilt Hydreco oil pressure pump?
Thanks.

Doesn't look like trans filings aeration can be overfill or slight air leak non of which is fatal.

 

[Jasper]

THANKS GUYS!

Feeling a bit more relaxed about the filings.
I will look into overcoming the aeration issue.
I'll check oil levels and try to get another Hydreco and use this one for a spare.

George

 

[rsmith]

With the Allison M gears, the port gears are more prone to failure than the starboard. There was a bearing issue that once addressed will fix this. If the gears were never rebuilt before, they probably had the old bearings. Like others have said, aeration is usually from a leak in the suction side or over/under filling of oil. I doubt it's the pump or a problem with the gear. You should give Tom Slane a call. I don't remember the exact details, but when he bought that boat the shafts were removed and at least one of the gears was off the engine. I believe one was missing when he got the boat. The PO was looking to go to a deeper reduction gear to try and gain some speed. That starboard gear may have been gone through already, but that was a while ago.

12's have the MH gears

 

[saltshaker]

12's have the MH gears

Even on the naturals? It's been a while but I remember M's being in that boat.