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Crusader Parts

  • Thread starter Thread starter cjd
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cjd

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Feb 25, 2006
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97
Hatteras Model
36' CONVERTIBLE-Series II (1983 - 1987)
If the deal goes thru, I will need to replace all risers, manifolds, elbows and hoses on a 36 that has 454 crusaders. Anyone here have a wholesale source to purchase these parts. I have been quoted 2500-3000 for the pair of engins. Seems alittle high to me.

Can't I get these parts from my local GM dealer.

Is this a DIY, 2 guys and a 12 pack job or better off paying someone to do it?

CJ
 
It's EASY DIY stuff! Go2 Marine is where I got all my Crusader parts before I became a Diesel boat owner. I assume they are still around - they had the best prices and free shipping on orders over a couple hundred bucks. Give them a try. When I did exactly what you are doing, Go2 charged me around 900 Bucks for all the parts.
 
I have those engines, why do you think all of that needs replacing? Rick
 
Your manifolds have anti-freeze in them. The risers at the back of the manifolds and the elbows after the risers are what needs changing every 5 years ONLY for boats in salt water. Fresh water guys have to change those parts about every 100 years. The problem is the salt water goes in at the double walled risers. That corrodes the inside wall of the risers and elbows. If a hole develops, sea water will back up into the cylinders with catastrophic results.
 
Rick,
Maynards right.
5 years seems to be the max in salt water from what I here.
Surveyor said these manifolds are 1985 original and the risers are stamped with the year 1993. Its a must do.

Thanks Mike P for the tip on the supplier. I will call them on Monday.
I also just found some deals at www.marineenginparts.com which was posted on a thread originated by Maynard. I should have done my research. Has anyone used these guys?
CJ
 
Any other Crusader tips??? I'm new to saltwater. Thanks
 
Your decision to replace the risers/elbows is a good one. I did that AUTOMATICALLY on ANY used boat unless the PO could prove they were changed within the last two years. I would change them every 5 years at the MOST in salt water.

You cannot tell what is happening in there so the only way to prevent serious problems w/ elbows/risers is to replace them. Well, that's not really true. You could remove and inspect them but in my mind, you might as well replace them if you are going to pull them. In boat dollars, they don't really cost all that much.

As was pointed out, the manifolds don't suffer from the effects of the Salt Water and should not need to be replaced under normal conditions. However, if there have been leaks at the manifold/riser junction, that area of the manifold could be damaged by corrosion that would damage the mating surfaces of the manifold where it joins the riser.

You will see when you redo them that the gasket at the riser/elbow joint has one hole in the top of the gasket while the riser and elbow have three holes. DO NOT make additional holes in the gasket to match the riser/elbow holes. The top hole is the only one that is supposed to be open. If you open the others you will create a hot spot at the top of the riser/elbow which can cause serious damage.

Be sure to use copious anti-seize on the full length of the riser studs. Depending on how lucky you are and whether the previous replacer did so, you may find removing the risers - they slide off of the 7 or 8 inch-long studs- to be fairly easy or frightfully difficult. I have had them come off in 15 minutes :) and have had them take 4 hours (for ONE riser)! :mad:
 
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On my last boat, I had the Crusader 454s. Great engines. I replaced my risers, even though they looked fine to the eye. Ed used a infrared thermometer on them and found hot spots coming through. In light of that, I wanted to replace them, even though she was a fresh water boat, before a hole came through and potentially sunk the boat. Once those risers were off where we could see the inside, yes...it was time!
 
are manifodls always coolant cooled on crusaders ? on mercs they're usually raw water cooled and needs to be replaced every 5 years too in salt water.

either way it is a DIY job.. risers usually come off easily, manifods can be harder if the bolts have rusted out... last time i did it on a gas boat, the bolts heads were badly rusted after 5 years that i had to get the shop to finish the job and cutting the bolts. they replaced htem with SS bolts to avoid the problem in the future...
 
Pascal,

When I repowered last I was told to not use stainless because later on removal can be tough if they sieze up in the hole...cutting them is a royal biotch. I put grade 5 back in. Stainless isn't always free of rust unless you get 316 grade...
 
One thing you have to watch when replacing steel bolts/studs with SS; SS is NOT as strong as regular bolts in the same size so it's possible that the torque setting for the oem nuts/studs, depending on the application, could fracture the SS stud/bolt. With risers I don't think it would be a problem because they are not all that tight as I recall but you should determine the proper torque setting for the SS fittings if you decide to use them.

Frankly, I don't see any reason to do it for this application any more than you would replace the normal engine bolts with SS.
 
I did this a few years back on the gas engines which were in my boat when I bought her...Mercs, which are not as good as Crusaders. I used better bolts, and a lot of antiseize. I did have to go back and retorque everything at least once, as places leaked. There were also a bunch of plugs in the manifolds etc, which OSCO said not to install with Teflon tape, but to use pipe dope or sealant. Evidently Teflon tape lets you overtorque the plugs and then they crack? Anyone know anything about this?

I'm curious; how long can you keep a set of risers in brackish or salt water if you lay the boat up three months a year and flush the seawater system with fresh water and lay them up with the pink stuff in the system? Do you still get only five years or is it longer?
 
Teflon tape is a tool of the devil without having any redeeming features to go along with the problems it causes. Don't use it for anything; use the appropriate dope for the specific use. Teflon can cause the issue you mentioned AND, of course, the teflon strips that get chewed up as you screw fluid fittings together will end up clogging something in the system. It's fine for home use but, IMHO, has no place on a boat and there is none in my rather extensive on-board liquids, potions and tape box!

As far as risers, I always used Mr Pascoe's advice, I know we have talked about some of his views on other issues but he's never steered me wrong re boats and I've been using his info including several personal phone calls with him since the mid '90s:

http://www.yachtsurvey.com/exhaust_risers.htm
 
Pascal said:
are manifodls always coolant cooled on crusaders ? on mercs they're usually raw water cooled and needs to be replaced every 5 years too in salt water.

either way it is a DIY job.. risers usually come off easily, manifods can be harder if the bolts have rusted out... last time i did it on a gas boat, the bolts heads were badly rusted after 5 years that i had to get the shop to finish the job and cutting the bolts. they replaced htem with SS bolts to avoid the problem in the future...
Click to expand...
Yup, Pascal...The 454 cu.in. Crusaders all have anti-freeze cooled exhaust manifolds. That is why each engine holds 8 gallons of mixed anti-freeze. I think most Merccruisers have sea watercooling the manifolds. The only 2 parts on a Crusader exhaust that are in the sea water stream are the risers and elbows.
 
Here is a site with a couple of diagrams and explanations of the different types of closed cooling systems.

http://www.perfprotech.com/

I never bought anything from them since I didnt need anything but I found their site helpful.

Give them a shot maybe they can help you understand the system and what you need to do.

FWIW when I worked in the boatyards one old boss of mine would buy the cheapest manifolds and risers knowing they would need replacement sooner than quality products. He also added valve grinding compound to oil changes and charged for work never performed. Be careful of who you use if you don,t do it yourself. Get good quality parts and don,t skimp or it will get you in teh end.
 
http://www.marineengineparts.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/page14.html

these guys have great prices.

risers, upper elbows and lower elbows. no need to replace manifolds. however buy all new bolts, studs and copper seals. you may find the surface of the manifold pitted when you pull the riser. if it is bad you will have to pull the manifold and have it machined. if it is minor you can use a planer block. i went to Lowes and bought the course knife sharpening stone, it is perfectly flat and will allow you to hone a very good surface. I painted my risers and elbows at home and baked them in the oven.
 
Thanks everybody. If negotiations go my way, I will price things out from these places and attempt to try this will try the replacement on my own.
I think i will save alot of money for other things I plan to do. Stay tuned!

CJ
 
CJ This has gone to the top of my list of todos, please keep me informed on your findings as well. It may be a month before I'm able to get to my boat but thanks to this forum, some preventive maint may save me (and you) a ton of money. Thanks to all the input. Rick
 
all those with gas engines, if you have not changed to electronic ignition then do it, not very expensive.

I discussed this before but will post again. We pulled our mallory distributors and sent them back to mallory and they rebuilt them for 75 each, did not mess with points parts as we were adding the Pertronix moduel. Pertronix are not realy considered electronic ignition but they are an electronic moduel that replaces the points, they work well and dont need to be touched again. this was a very inexpensive upgrade. now in retrospect i may recommend completely new distributory, most like the prestolite. Either way get rid of the points and save time on tune ups and poor performance with warn points.
 
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