Beware of this great economy?

[krush]

Don't know about you, but when I see articles like this and super strong boat prices (look at outrageous asking prices for 10-20yr old center consoles on thehulltruth...and then there is new boat prices), I get a bit gun-shy.

https://www.yachtingjournal.com/news/broker-sells-four-665333

Former big boat captain turned superyacht broker, Mark Elliott, sold four brokerage vessels during the first quarter of 2019, closing for $48 million. Three of the boats moved in March.

Deals closed on M/Y Bella Una, a 127-foot Burger, as well as Christensen’s 164-foot M/Y Three Forks,124-foot M/Y Carte Blanche by Trinity, and 157-foot M/Y Carolina, a classic Feadship.

The strong economy and consumer spending confidence demonstrate the yacht market has definitely bounced back. A veteran 20-year broker with IYC, Elliott hasn’t seen this kind of activity since his strongest years, preceding 2008.

“It’s the Trump effect,” said Elliott. “People feel good about the economy which has been very robust the last few years.”

 

[rsmith]

It’s no longer the cost it’s how much a month. No worries happy days are here again. And we’re all going to get guaranteed minimum income!

 

[krush]

And we’re all going to get guaranteed minimum income!

Philosophically, I think minimum income is foolish. Pragmatically, give me my $1000/month instead of boomer politicians wasting it in government wars, welfare, medicare. Your average millennial is underemployed and can't afford to even buy a house, but the group of people that lived through the greatest economy in history can't understand why the youngsters foolishly embrace "socialism".

PS: Don't put words in the above sentence that are not there. Nowhere do I compliment or condone communism/socialism.

 

[UNIQUE_NAME]

i don't think its that we can't understand them. think back to being 18-25 or so and pretend the local bar serves free beer to anyone under 25.
you know someone is paying for the beer, but as long as its not you its all good.
problem is, we will be the ones paying for it now.

 

[Sharon Jean]

Your average millennial is underemployed and can't afford to even buy a house, but the group of people that lived through the greatest economy in history can't understand why the youngsters foolishly embrace "socialism".

I would disagree that the average millennial is underemployed.
"Underemployed" implies that they are not being paid what they are worth.

When you take into account the poor quality of current public/higher education, lack of practical real world experience, and lousy social skills, I think the average millennial is being paid exactly what they are worth.

 

[rsmith]

I don’t know if that’s just a hipster Portlandia perception generated by the media or not really representative of millennial sin general. Just as an example I just sold 2 building lots contiguous with my family’s property just outside of Philadelphia. 3/4 acre lots nice area but typical 3/2 bedroom community. I was going to build myself but the realtor told me I couldn’t get more than 3-350k for the houses I’d be better just to sell the lots to a builder. The guy built a couple not impressive 3/2 crackerboxes with builder quality finish. Both sold in less than 30 days for over 500k to two early thirties couples. Both put over 100k extra in the houses to finish them off. They all work either in mid level management jobs and have combined income in the 250k range. 600k is a lot of dough for a first house but it seems to be the norm in the northeast anyhow.

 

[motoryacht lover]

I know quite a few very hardworking honest millennials with good jobs and disposable income. I think it has always been the same. 10% carry the remaining 90%. The millennials have some infected with the socialist leaning just like the boomers and the generation before them. Before we go blaming the boomers it was the boomers parents (the greatest generation) the elected FDR for 3 terms albeit under extenuating circumstances. The greatest generation was not free of socialist leaning people. I was formerly optimistic about America’s future but America has some real challenges ahead of it and so far we don’t seem to have the will to address them. Hopefully the millennials will do what previous generations (greatest included) have not and force our politicians to be a accountable.

 

[krush]

I would disagree that the average millennial is underemployed.

It doesn't matter...even if a millennial is fully employed and paid well, the last 10+ years of zero/low (ZIRP) interest rates has PUNISHED people that save.

Try $20,000 a year to attend a state "average" school studying engineering (tuition +room/food). This is for in state residents. Out of state 40k.....a YEAR.

Boomers say "I worked full time in the summer and paid for college". HAHAHAHAHAHHAHA. And then people graduate with degrees and are underemployed. Many have useless degrees, but plenty of technical people are underployed. Oh yeah, $50-60k sounds like a lot out of school, but it's garbage when a house costs 400-500k and the person paid 80-100k for IN STATE tuition.

It will be interesting to see what happens to house prices as boomers begin to sell all the mcMansions that millenials don't want. Prices will likely crater.

 

[motoryacht lover]

It doesn't matter...even if a millennial is fully employed and paid well, the last 10+ years of zero/low (ZIRP) interest rates has PUNISHED people that save.

Try $20,000 a year to attend a state "average" school studying engineering (tuition +room/food). This is for in state residents. Out of state 40k.....a YEAR.

Boomers say "I worked full time in the summer and paid for college". HAHAHAHAHAHHAHA. And then people graduate with degrees and are underemployed. Many have useless degrees, but plenty of technical people are underployed. Oh yeah, $50-60k sounds like a lot out of school, but it's garbage when a house costs 400-500k and the person paid 80-100k for IN STATE tuition.

It will be interesting to see what happens to house prices as boomers begin to sell all the mcMansions that millenials don't want. Prices will likely crater.

Krush, I enjoy your input and in no way trying to start something but are you implying that millennials are victims of the economy created by boomers?

 

[jim rosenthal]

I wonder how many people on this forum have children that are millennials. (sp?) And I wonder how many would describe their own millennial children in the disparaging terms commonly used?

Maybe that's other peoples' children. Their children are not typical millennials.

 

[Jammin']

I wonder how many people on this forum have children that are millennials. (sp?) And I wonder how many would describe their own millennial children in the disparaging terms commonly used?

Maybe that's other peoples' children. Their children are not typical millennials.

I wrote a nice long post bragging on my kids, but I deleted it because it seemed a little self-serving.

 

[krush]

Krush, I enjoy your input and in no way trying to start something but are you implying that millennials are victims of the economy created by boomers?

I wouldn't use the word victim. I'm just saying, we shouldn't be too surprised at the ideology that comes from some millennials that so many find revolting if you analyze what it's been like for them.

The middle class has purchasing power has shrunk greatly, and the wealth has trickled to the top % to obscene levels. I think it makes the robber barons look downright kind. I'm not saying "it's not fair", but I'm am saying isn't it a little strange when you look at the concentration of wealth in % figures. Of course, there is also fiat currency and modern monetary policy to make it more awesome.

This article sums it up well: https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-05-01/workarounds-galore-how-real-americans-deal-real-inflation

 

[q240z]

Give everybody $1,000 a month, and watch what happens to prices. Just keep adding zeros to the cost of a loaf of bread.

Government schools have become a disaster. They're taxpayer-funded ideological indoctrination centers for the hard left. The government (unconstitutionally) taking over the college loan industry under the Hope & Change president opened the Treasury to the highest echelon of those indoctrination centers. With an unlimited supply of funding, prices did what prices always do in that situation. If the government got out of education entirely, the true market value of all of those useless SJW degrees would quickly become apparent.

It's as if a lot of people never took basic econ.

 

[Westfield 11]

Give everybody $1,000 a month, and watch what happens to prices. Just keep adding zeros to the cost of a loaf of bread.

Government schools have become a disaster. They're taxpayer-funded ideological indoctrination centers for the hard left. The government (unconstitutionally) taking over the college loan industry under the Hope & Change president opened the Treasury to the highest echelon of those indoctrination centers. With an unlimited supply of funding, prices did what prices always do in that situation. If the government got out of education entirely, the true market value of all of those useless SJW degrees would quickly become apparent.

It's as if a lot of people never took basic econ.

Was college really that cheap prior to 2000? I just don’t recall it being that way, but I could be wrong.

 

[Pascal]

It a never been cheap but costs have been increasing at a higher rate than inflation. You know you got to pay all these high speaking fees to people like the clintons, set up safe spaces for snowflakes, build transgender bathrooms and increasingly high salaries to professors who have never set foot in the real world. That cost money.

 

[q240z]

I went back for a different degree in 2000, worked a 30hr/week part-time job, took 18~22 credit hours per term, including summer, and graduated in 2003. Being a white, straight, male and achieving a GPA in the top 10% meant I was ineligible for any grants or scholarships outside of the Pell grant that was available to anybody with a C average. I paid off my student loans in 1.5 years. I think I owed ~$8,000 when I graduated. And that was with a very useful STEM degree that's served me well.

Even back then, I recall having to take a 300-level class on women's literature. It was part of the liberal arts diversity requirement to graduate. Apparently, you're not a well-rounded biologist unless you've read Jane Austin, who I found to be particularly tedious. Word has it the diversity requirements for graduation are far worse these days at many universities.

 

[motoryacht lover]

I wouldn't use the word victim. I'm just saying, we shouldn't be too surprised at the ideology that comes from some millennials that so many find revolting if you analyze what it's been like for them.

The middle class has purchasing power has shrunk greatly, and the wealth has trickled to the top % to obscene levels. I think it makes the robber barons look downright kind. I'm not saying "it's not fair", but I'm am saying isn't it a little strange when you look at the concentration of wealth in % figures. Of course, there is also fiat currency and modern monetary policy to make it more awesome.

This article sums it up well: https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-05-01/workarounds-galore-how-real-americans-deal-real-inflation

I briefly scanned the zero hedge article. The article mentions work arounds such as cleaning your own home, cutting your own grass, things of that nature. I don’t want to get into my financial situation but I could comfortably afford to have someone clean my office and my home and cut my homes grass. I do those things myself. Full disclosure my wife mostly cleans the house. I drive a 2011 F350 service body truck. My wife drives a 16 Ford Explorer. My point is this is how a lot of Boomers raised by the depression generation are living. So; do millennials have expectations that they shouldn’t have to do those things? Do you know how many people today cant fix their own toilet? We use to own apartments and a male tenant called about the bee infestation on his porch. I came prepared for a show down. It was a wasp nest that I took care of with a broom. To me that situation personifies a lot of Americans these days. The want to hit an app on an iPad and have someone instantly solve their problem. That cost money. I believe there is now a business picking up dog excrement in people’s yards. I have seen some working class people not only make money but build wealth doing what others don’t want to do. I have worked for a family business literally since I was 9 years old, spring break i came home and worked. The day after I graduated college I drove home and went to work. I have been working 6 days a week since. As I have aged I have slowed on the Saturdays and now go into the office for 3-4 hours. My father told me you won’t get ahead working 40 hours a week. So if the next generation expects to have what some of us have you are going to have to work more than 40 hours a week. Last thought, I believe I heard this right. If one makes $130,000/year he/she is in the top 10% of income earners. So if one makes 150,000 he or she would most likely define themselves as middle class. Statistics say they are at a minimum upper middle class.

 

[SeaEric]

When I started Bayport Yachts 30 years ago, I had young families with children coming in and buying boats. Those days are over. My average customer now is around 70 years of age. Thank God they still want to buy 40+ ft power boats because that's what I mostly sell. I never went to college except for a few business courses here and there. I have still managed to scratch out a nice standard of living. I agree with the previous poster - If you think business hours are between 9 and 5 you are correct. But to be successful that would be 5AM and 9PM hours not the other way around.

 

[Sharon Jean]

The government (unconstitutionally) taking over the college loan industry under the Hope & Change president opened the Treasury to the highest echelon of those indoctrination centers. With an unlimited supply of funding, prices did what prices always do in that situation.

I 100% agree. College is not the best choice for everyone, yet most young adults are told "you have to get a degree in order to succeed today".
Guaranteed college loans are made readily available, and if the student fails and defaults, you and I the taxpayers are on the hook.
The Universities still get paid, tuition continues to rise, and the circle continues.

If the universities were made responsible for even a portion of these defaulted loans, things would fall in line quickly.

 

[Pascal]

Going back to the original post, the average boat size is increasing at an amazing pace. A few years back, a 100 footer was huge. Nowadays it s nothing. Over the last 2 months we spent 6 weeks in the Exumas, spring break being the busy season there. I d say 50% of motoryachts are now over 100’ and plenty of 150 footers. And up. Amazing.

Many of these boats are on the charter market at rates over $100k a week. Plus expenses. Plus tips.

And they re pretty busy.... not just tax write off that sit at the dock