58 motoryacht/cockpit motoryacht 3 vs 4 staterooms??

[hyperfishing]

Okay, pros vs cons as a liveaboard unit.....

The 4 stateroom seems to make more sense as a live-a-board unit, merely for storage space considerations. Yes? No? Two staterooms for storage, one as a guest room/office.

Or, do you feel cramped with the smaller salon?

 

[Angela]

Just a few things to consider to start...

A couple of key differences on these two is (1) how bad do you want a cockpit (3SR); and (2) how do you feel about the galley up model (4SR)?

Both of these boats make great liveaboards and have an abundance of storage. I’ve seen more than one take the 4SR, galley up model and turn the smallest stateroom into an office, and I’ve seen some take out the crew dinette and make a desk or large dresser there.

Others folks have a MUST HAVE attitude towards a cockpit. I wish I had one, but I’m not willing to give up my 4SR, galley up model in exchange for it. I’d like to just add a cockpit instead...have my cake and eat it too.

Neither of these boats, to the best of my knowledge, have walk-around decks which is something I’d really like to have. I’m talking about the Series I - I don’t think any of the Series II were made in the 4SR, galley up model.

Galley up means whomever is doing the cooking can still be a part of the crowd and enjoying the company rather than being stuck downstairs in the galley, away from everyone else. This also means that your galley and its occasional mess is right there on display in front of everyone, too. Everything is a compromise. You’ll enjoy replacing the galley appliances in a 4SR galley up model much more than you will in the 3SR galley down model.

You first need to determine whether a cockpit is important to you. For example, do you have dogs that are too big to carry who will need to get on and off the boat and into a dinghy from time to time? If so, then you need a cockpit.

My recollection is that the 3SR, cockpit motoryacht version has a smaller master SR due to the existence of the cockpit. They had to take that space from somewhere. Still, both boats have an abundance of storage. If you’re comparing strictly storage capacity, then the 4SR, galley up, probably has more. If the cubic feet of storage is driving your decision, then you have too much stuff!

 

[Pascal]

galley up is great... but to be honest the galley down with dinette is not bad either. Depends how you use the boat. if you entertain a lot, parties, etc... teh galley up is a big plus. as a pure liveaboard, i like the dinette.

I wish i had a cockpit...that's all i can say... if the extra 5' isn't an issue, then you cna't beat the 58YF...

Sidedecks? not needed for maneuvring. since you do it all from the lower helm, you are just a few steps form your spring lines which are the first one you pass ashore. To go to the stern, going inside our outside makes no difference.

the big plus of having sidedecks is the amount of breeze you get on the aft deck... HUGE difference. Anchored on a 53MY or 58YF, you get a ton of breeze on the aft deck making it very comfortable even in august in SoFL

with an ED, air flow is cut by 90%....

finally, the galley down models have much better cross ventilation than the galley up with the partition... anchored out, you get twice the amount of air coming thru the side doors compared to jst the side windows. i like fresh air and we normally only run the AC at night when anchored in summer, thanks to the good cross ventilation the saloon remains cool.

it's all about compromise...

 

[hyperfishing]

Great points as usual from Ang and Pascal. But, why is the aft deck so important when you can hang out on the flybridge under the bimini?

 

[Angela]

This is a hard one to answer. People naturally gather on the aft deck because they just do.

The aft deck is just where people naturally gravitate. The flybridge requires going up and down a ladder. There are usually beverages and food involved in spending the day on the boat and it's just easier to serve on the aft deck than it is to hoist everything up and down a ladder. I've seen some flybridges outfitted with cooking facilities, ice maker, refrigerator, etc., and I wonder if those see more traffic up there.

When folks come out of the water from swimming, the aft deck is where they land. On the 58MY and 58CMY, to get to the flybridge, you have to go inside and through the boat to the pilothouse to go up to the FB.

When its raining, the aft deck is nice as it keeps the rain off of you - the bimini on the FB doesn't do that quite as well.

The aft deck is just more convenient to things around the boat and for whatever reason, people just seem to naturally gravitate there rather than the flybridge. We don't try to corral people to here...it's just where they go.

Now, when we're underway, it's the flybridge where you'll find everyone.

Now, some of the 58s don't have the aft deck that Pascal and I have. Instead, some of them have just a very small one, about 3 or 5 feet long like a balcony you'd step out on, providing more room inside the salon. I don't know where that style boat draws people for being outdoors. Maybe it is the flybridge and if so, maybe that's because there isn't really an aft deck. I'm not sure. I believe Sky has an 53MY with an extended deckhouse, giving him that little aft deck. If that's right, maybe he can say where people tend to gather on that floor plan.

My FB has been modified for charter service and it's a huge area - much larger than the usable area that Hatteras intended. Still, that's not where people naturally gather unless we are underway.

...best I can explain it...there's really no answer for why people end up hanging out on the aft deck...they just do.

To get the ventilation on the aft deck Pascal described, you'll have to bail on the notion of having a 58MY or 58CMY and go for the 58YF, unless you look at the 58MY in a Series II which will cost a lot more to purchase and to keep. The ladder to access the FB in a 58YF is from the aft deck rather than the PH.

On Mario's 58YF, the FB gets a lot of use - that's where they play Cuban Dominos. His FB also sees a lot of traffic because there is always a large crowd on his boat and they've got to go somewhere.

 

[hyperfishing]

"They just do." Interesting. Humm, seems like you could do some paid research on that. <gg>

I agree the mini aft deck on the Cockpit Motoryacht is not very user friendly, as opposed to the aft deck on the yachtfish. But, I prefer the cockpit pilothouse steps up to the flybridge rather than the aft deck ladder on the yachtfish.

You made a great point about dirty dishes in the salon galley vs downstairs.

Ang, how is the visibility when backing up your motoryacht?? I guess that is another advantage of the yachtfish over the ED cockpit motoryachts, or not?

 

[SKYCHENEY]

Our huge salon is a gathering point but as far as being outside, it is usually the bridge and the bow. With a large bow seat and 2 deckboxes, we have almost as much seating there as on the bridge. All of the above comments give pros and cons to each of these designs. It all depends on where you plan to cruise and how you plan to use the the boat. We are in a northern climate and the larger inside spaces work out well for us.

 

[Angela]

Ang, how is the visibility when backing up your motoryacht?? I guess that is another advantage of the yachtfish over the ED cockpit motoryachts, or not?

I think it sucks, but I'll defer that question to Pascal who single hands our boat from the pilothouse without a problem, and I've never docked from down there.

Backing in from the flybridge is no piece of cake either since someone has to climb over the railing and into the dinghy to see where the swim platform is in relation to the pilings and then report back to whomever is driving. The pilings cannot be seen from the FB helm either. I've put 10-foot PVC pipes as extensions on the pilings to help with finding them.

 

[SKYCHENEY]

Backing in is no problem at all from the pilothouse, IMO. When at the helm, you are only a couple of steps from either side door. Just step over there and look back at the corner of your boat. No problem.

I never dock from the bridge, however, as you can't see anything up there.

 

[Pascal]

many guests hang aroudn at the bow, weather permitting... if it's windy or the sun is too hot then it's the aft deck and flybridge.

I prefer the ladder on the aft deck! again it depends on how you use the boat but this way you dont' track water inside when coming out of the water and going up... and since we spend a lot of tiem on the aft deck, it's closer.

visibility aft in a pilot house boat isnt great, but not real issue. Indeed a couple of steps to the side deck and you see your aft corner. on later models like the 54, Hatteras placed the door in the middle which let you see aft. not a bad design.

Ideally with a pilothouse, you want a camera at the stern... I wonder if you could put some clamp on side mirrors on the railing to see the corners.. I tried to suggest that to Angela but she though it was a little 18 wheelish-red neckish! even removable...

 

[yachtbrokerguy]

I was captain of a 58 YF back in the 1980's. The previous owner had two fiberglass poles about 12 feet long, and about the thickness of a whip antenna. Installed in each aft corner of the cockpit were stainless plates with a hole in them for mounting the fiberglass poles upright, making the tops of them visible from the wheel on the flybridge. I used them for the first few months of running the boat, and thought they were an inexpensive aid in knowing where the back of the boat was, when backing into a slip.

 

[Angela]

I usually know where the back of the boat is, it's the pilings that I can't see that concern me. They don't move when you hit them, well, most of them don't. I'll have to learn to back the way Pascal does - from the pilothouse. He's very good with the 58MY in that regard and makes it look like a piece of cake.

 

[hyperfishing]

Ha ha about the pilings! More great points re ladders outside vs inside.

We saw a cockpit motoryacht with optional cockpit steering we liked very much, several years ago. Have not seen another equipped like that since.

How much is one of those trick wireless remote control steering units, including installation?

 

[Pascal]

expensive... and you probably also need electronic controls instead of cables...

frankly on a boat with a pilothouse, you dont' really need a set of controls on the aft deck. if visibility is an issue, then a rear cam is all you need to back the boat from teh pilothouse.

If you only have a flybridge, then yes, cockpit or aft deck controls will place you close to your lines without having to rush down the steps.

the Johnson 70 i took to Nantucket a couple of months ago has a set of controls on the aft deck which is nice for single handling instead of rushing down the stairs form the skylounge. although to back the boat in, from the helm you can actually see the swim platform port corner for the helm upstairs. The sight angle down the stairs and thru the aft deck gate down the steps to the swi mplatform is perfect.

 

[Angela]

My neighbor has one of those handheld remote controls. I'll ask him how much it was. Interesting device.

 

[hyperfishing]

Terrific, never would have thought of the camera. Okay, how much to install a rear camera in a weatherproof housing, plus video monitor?

How much also to install a cockpit steering station. Do the Hatteras yachtfish/cockpit motoryachts setups permit easy installation since cockpit controls were an option?

 

[Angela]

My neighbor said that remote control, installed was $8,000.

 

[hyperfishing]

Thanks Ang, not bad! I assume the installation was on a traditional cable steered boat?

I'll bet installing a rear steer station would cost at least that much, and the remote obviously beats the heck out of that.

 

[Angela]

I'm sure that boat has micro-commanders. I can't imagine any way possible to use that on a traditional cable steered boat without a "man behind the curtain." Just ain't no way!

 

[DeeRow]

Terrific, never would have thought of the camera. Okay, how much to install a rear camera in a weatherproof housing, plus video monitor?

Most high end Multi-function Displays (MFD) support video inputs. Garmin 42XX and 52XX, Raymarine E and G series have video inputs. Furuno NavNet 10" has a video option which is purchased seperately and field installed.

Raymarine has a outdoor camera with reverse image for a rear view which Boatfix sells for $457.

Mark