53 vs 58 TC Advantages and Disadvantages

[eclipsarkanna]

I have seen a lot of opinions on a whole bunch of different threads where the 53 owners lay out some great arguments and the 58 owners debate or qualify those advantages and disadvantages. I believe a lot of existing and potential Hatt buyers could benefit a lot from putting this debate on one thread for future reference. I had to go to the 'retirement thread', the 'boat market' thread and a couple of other places where good comments were made (like having to move the salon to one side to work on an engine of a 58TC vs a walk-in on a 53). If I am wrong then this goes nowhere and I bow my head in shame. If it goes as I hope, then we will all benefit in fully understanding and hearing from those that own what I believe to be the two most popular Hatts out there (the 53s and the 58s). Plus, there are some really good debaters out there like "The Bird" who will tell it like it is; Sky who has made some great points on the 53ED and others (sorry -can't remember the names) who have brought up great points.

Bill

 

[ThirdHatt]

If it goes as I hope, then we will all benefit in fully understanding and hearing from those that own what I believe to be the two most popular Hatts out there (the 53s and the 58s).

Okay, here goes. The 58TC was not a popular Hatteras. It was only in production for 5 yrs or so. Take a look on the market and you will see that there simply aren't that many out there compared to the 53's or the other varieties of the 58. They simply did not sell very many 58TC's, and began making 58's in other configurations (YF, MY series I and II, CY, etc) which were based on the successful design of the 53 and ALL had the walk-in engine rooms and remained in production for a long time. When the new boats would come out like the 54MY, the 56MY, 58MY, widebody 58MY (series II), 58CY, 61CMY & 61MY, the 63CMY & MY, the 67CMY and the 68CMY were ALL based on the successful design of the 53 Classic with the split walk-in engine rooms. I think that speaks loudly for the success of a design when it continually gets implemented and updated for several decades.

Now, I personally know and respect the 'Bird but unfortunately by no fault of his own he has barely put any time at all on his 58TC (read "Maiden Voyage from Hell" thread) and therefore has no real cruising experience on that platform from which to speak. Also, his is for sale so I would imagine that his opinion will be a bit slanted on this particular subject. Take it easy 'Bird, lower your weapons please. I'm just speaking the truth. No offense meant at all my friend.

As far as searching through several different threads to get all the info you are looking for, that is quite normal. If you do a search for a particular subject, you will be amazed at the different thread titles that come up yet they all have posts about the subject you searched within them.

Honestly, I think that your best bet is to go aboard as many different Hatteras' as you can so that you can personally see the differences that pictures cannot translate. It really is a "to each his own" choice but the sheer production numbers do not lie. They tell what sells, therefore what the majority likes. When a basic design spans several decades, you can't go wrong!

GOOD LUCK!!!

 

[Pascal]

yes, the number of split ER boat really speaks for itself, doesn't it? it is considered one of the best small MY design ever and remained in production well in to the 80s if not early 90s.

advantages of the 53 layout :

- walk in ERs
- more privacy in the master SR thanks to the companionway
- lower helm with side doors right where you want it to be
- better view from the main saloon
- more privacy from the saloon as it sits higher. people on the dock don't have a diving view in your living room

the 58TC is a fine boat, but more of a carry over design from the typical 60s early 70s MY like the bertrams, CC, etc...

 

[ThirdHatt]

Pascal, the 67CMY was in production until 1995. That's a full 30 yrs of production from the 1965 50MY that started this design standard and the last boat to benefit was the 1995 67CMY. WOW. Pretty amazing stuff!

I agree the 58TC is a fine boat, just not the trend setting legend that the Classic is.

 

[CARL GUZMAN]

Thirdhat is right I gotta tell you when I was shopping I looked for the biggest porch!!! it's where you hang out the most. the 58CPMY has the 2nd biggest porch and is very nice. lets face it we all want to live on the water , why? because we want to feel that breeze and be at the waters edge. If you ask me the 70' has no porch at all and no outside spaces.

 

[thoward]

If you are near Ft Pierce, Fla. this weekend you can come check out our 60C.
Phone# 352-636-2840
Tod

 

[SKYCHENEY]

The 58TC is a beautiful classic. It was really a copy of the 1960's designs much like the 57 Chris Craft Constellation. I love those lines and the 70' Hatteras of that era is one of my favorites. That design is the same as the 38DC, 41DC/TC and the 43DC. Many of the owners of these smaller versions can also tell you the merits of the 58TC as their boats are very similar except smaller.

The 53MY/ED and the 58MY series I are totally different designs than the 58TC. They are true pilothouse motoryachts. The lower helm on the these boats is set much farther forward and this affords more room for living space on this level. The lines are not as sleek as having that huge foredeck cabin house in front of you that you get with the 58TC, but you gain the sliding doors. Those doors are great for quick access to the side deck as Pascal stated. It makes the 53/58MY very easy to handle since you need only take a couple of steps from the helm to secure a spring line.

I grew up on a 43DC and it is very similar to the 58TC and our dock neighbor had a 57CC Connie. That style is great except as stated, you have poor engine room access and a main salon that is down and a galley that is way down. I check my engine rooms on at least an hourly basis while cruising and it is so easy to just open those doors in the passageway and step in for a quick peek. I would not give that up.

The 53/58MY also has a separare generator/battery room. This is another storage area and it keeps the batteries isolated from the hot engine rooms. Most times we only run on inverter and the inverter and batteries stay cool. This extends battery life. Access to the batteries is also better for maintenance and replacement.

I have always wanted to own a 53MY. I looked at numerous vessels over many years, but I ended up with the ED. It has some advantages over the MY, but is also has some disadvantages. You lose the open aft deck, but you gain a huge salon. The salon is like that of the 18'2" widebody walkarounds. You also gain a built-in pilot house seat and storage. Many have added similar seats to the MY, however. My boat had the bulkhead cut out behind the pilothouse to open it up to the salon. This is a big improvement to the ED which I really like.

As others have said, it is a matter of personal preferrence, but production numbers do state that the 53MY was the most popular Hatteras that was not a fishing platform. In fact, it was one of the most popular motoryachts ever produced by any manufacturer with Grand Banks probably holding the record with their 42' trawler.

 

[Boss Lady]

when it comes to Hats it is all good, with some better. I would go look at as many as you can, then take a realistic look at how you "really" intend to use the boat. That will make the decision on which particular model you really favor. I wish I could have three or four, then I would have one for every occassion.

 

[SKYCHENEY]

I wish I could have three or four, then I would have one for every occassion.

I agree with that. In fact, there are several multiple Hatt owners on this site. I envy that prospect, just not the expense.

 

[Freebird]

LOL Hey Byron and Sky, aren't you boys always talking about quality is better than quantity? Who the hell cares how many 58's were made vs 53's? Economic conditions probably dictated how many 58TC's were built, but that is just a suggestion as I really do not know.

Sometimes manufacturers realize they have put too much into a particular design and discontinue it because they can make more money with something else. Maybe one of us should call Hatteras and see if they want to offer their view on this subject. In the end, it really doesn't matter does it?

As to my limited time in running this boat, what do you think I would have viewed differently by running this boat sporadically for six months vs running it in proper running condition for about 20 hours over a three day period? I have run many a Hatt after I bought this 58. None impressed me as being better in any way other than the bigger ones I have run which impressed me as simply being bigger. Truth is, mine felt the same or better than any other Hatt I have ever operated. Should I list the ones I have operated for you? It really doesn't matter as it is just my opinion, but I assure you, this part of my opinion is not biased. It is just based on the facts of what I have experienced.

I bought this 58TC for one reason and one reason only, price. Had I found a 53ED or 58MY for $117K in the same condition, who the hell knows what I would have bought. I was prepared to spend at least twice that amount, but there is no way I would have done that after viewing and running this boat. EVERY design has differences which can be viewed as positive or negative, it all boils down to personal preference.

I have to tell you, split stand up engine rooms do absolutely nothing for me. I've been on boats that have these, and they simply do not impress me. Now a big full beam stand-up engine room like on a 70 seems to give the best of both worlds, but that boat is not in the running for Bill (unless he has mood swings like I do!). Sure, you can stand up in a split engine room, but they make a long dungeon-like hallway where the 58TC has a mid stateroom and two heads. The split engine rooms give very limited access to the inside half of the engine. You have to remove a panel to access this portion of the engines. IMHO two choices of entry into an engine room is better than one. The 58TC has that. You can literally remove every square inch of the salon floor via hatches to give you way more headroom than you will ever find in ANY other engine room on a Hatteras, period. Entering through the steps in the galley is fine for general maintenance.

Then becomes the issue of what is involved should you want or need to remove the engines completely. You have to cut the top out of the lower salon roof to remove the engines. Sounds scary, but I am told it is no big deal and was designed with that in mind. How the heck do you remove the engines in a split walk-in engine room. To my knowledge, you don't. Unless of course you want to cut out the side of the hull. I've heard this is really not a big deal either, but it would scare the hell out of me.

I am not sure how Angela views a 58TC as having more ups and downs than a 58MY. As memory serves, there is no difference in this area. The 58TC has an upper salon/pilothouse, one level. Three steps down to the lower salon which is one level. Three steps down aft of the main salon is the companionway leading to the aft master with a guest stateroom to port, and two back to back identical heads to starboard with one having private access to the master only. Three steps down from the main salon forward is the galley and foward stateroom with a head to starboard, all on one level. Sounds like four different levels to me. I looked at my hand and had one finger left over!

Granted looks aren't everything, but who wants an ugly woman when you can have a pretty one? Who buys an ugly house, car, truck... whatever, over a pretty one? Shallow?, maybe. But I think everyone who has expressed an opinion has agreed with me that the 58TC is prettier than its "houseboatish" 58 and 53 counterparts. The 58TC feels like a much larger boat than even a 70 because of that long sleek foredeck.

Sum this short story up like it began, it is all just a matter of personal taste and preference tempered by price. My 58TC is pretty, and the price is unbeatable in any comparison. Why didn't I just say that in the first place?

 

[Boss Lady]

Maybe because there would be no entertainment value in a short answer. LOL

 

[nyrussell]

well, our next Hatt is either a 53, 58, or 64 MY. We will need to move up soon

Or maybe an LRC

Noel

opps, meant but for our Hatt

 

[Freebird]

Maybe because there would be no entertainment value in a short answer. LOL

You think?

Maybe I should rephrase that, some members don't seem to think, but I know you do!

I think I have the only 58TC for sale and nobody else is trying to sell a 53ED, a 53, or a 58MY, so why all the negative crap? Just kidding, sort of.

Quit trying to confuse my customer!!!

 

[Freebird]

Thirdhat is right I gotta tell you when I was shopping I looked for the biggest porch!!! it's where you hang out the most. the 58CPMY has the 2nd biggest porch and is very nice. lets face it we all want to live on the water , why? because we want to feel that breeze and be at the waters edge. If you ask me the 70' has no porch at all and no outside spaces.

You keep talking about porches and I'm taking you to the basement!

Dang it, now I'm going to have to go to the boat's kitchen, drink a couple of beers, and go to one of the three bathrooms. Then I'll sit in one of the two living rooms on my 58 and think about heading for one of the three bedrooms. I think I may take a shower in the master bath before I go to bed. Then again, if I do that I will have to clean it up if company comes. Maybe I'll use one of the other two showers. Dang, this boat is just too big for one person, and I'm getting all confused.

GuzBoy, when are you going to start talking like a boater instead of a real estate salesman?

 

[Pascal]

what is the headroom in the ER on the 58TC witht he hatches down ?

FWIW, you can pull the engines from the 53MY and 58YF without cutting anything... jsut roll the carpet and unscrew the hatches.

as to the inside panels in the companionway, you rarely need to open them...

one last thing i like about the classic layout is how the saloon opens to the aft deck, creating one large area.

 

[CARL GUZMAN]

GuzBoy, when are you going to start talking like a boater instead of a real estate salesman?

I told you that 70' is crap ! who wants a dinning room on a boat it's a good live aboard but you can't : fish, dive, walk around the boat, etc.
It has a 3ft cocpit and a 3ft porch Maybe for one plastic chair?

 

[Freebird]

I told you that 70' is crap ! who wants a dinning room on a boat it's a good live aboard but you can't : fish, dive, walk around the boat, etc.
It has a 3ft cocpit and a 3ft porch Maybe for one plastic chair?

You ain't never going to sound like a yachtsman are you BubbAmigo? First you talk about porches and living rooms, now you want to talk about dining rooms.

I hate to sound like a moderator, but we are talking about 53 vs 58TC's, not 70's. Besides, my dream boat I mentioned would be a 70CPMY which does have a smaller "porch" but the cockpit is almost as big as yours. You can walk around it, you just have to hang on!

Don't make me chase you off this porch again!

 

[Freebird]

what is the headroom in the ER on the 58TC witht he hatches down ?

FWIW, you can pull the engines from the 53MY and 58YF without cutting anything... jsut roll the carpet and unscrew the hatches.

as to the inside panels in the companionway, you rarely need to open them...

one last thing i like about the classic layout is how the saloon opens to the aft deck, creating one large area.

The headroom when the hatches are down is more than adequate for checking/changing fluids and/or filters. Everything else is very accessable on BOTH sides of the engines. I'm 6'1" 230lbs and I have no difficulty doing what I need to do in respect to the aforementioned. I can sit up straight with no problems. Oh yeah, Sky why the heck do you feel the need to check your engines on an hourly basis? Who is driving the boat while you do this, and what do you do when you singlehand the boat?

How the heck do you pull the engines on your boat by rolling the carpet and unscrewing the hatches? I don't mean to sound like a smartass, but I fail to see how that would help do anything other than to possibly get the engines into the companionway. Are there hatches overhead? If so, what then? What the heck do you do with them from there? Same question would apply to the really big stand-up ER on the 70.

Again, I'm not trying to downplay your preference, I may end up with one of these some day and would really like to know how you get the engines out.

 

[SKYCHENEY]

Randy,
I check my engines to make sure I don't have any problems. That way I hope to catch an oil or water leak, smoke, strange sound, vibration, etc before I starve it for oil and blow it up like you did. And as far as running the boat, I don't run it single handed. I always have at least one other person aboard, usually my wife. Besides, most of time when I need to go down to check I'm in several hundred feet of water in the middle of Lake Michigan with no other boats in site and running on autopilot.

On the 53MY the hatches are above. You set up and A-frame and pull them up. Then you wheel them out the back doors and lift them off of the back deck. Pay attention. This has been covered numerous times here . I'm not trying to discourage the sale of your boat. I'm just trying to answer the question that was asked. I'm sorry if you don't like my answers but I'm not your broker.

 

[ThirdHatt]

It's true Randy, my 58YF has hatches in the ER ceilings/salon floor like the 53's as well to lift the engines out and into the salon. Then they can be rolled to the aft deck (porch) and removed from the boat.

Doesn't everyone do hourly engine room checks while underway? I thought that was common knowledge/good practice. I guess if I had to move furniture or crawl on all fours in a hot engine crawlspace I may forgoe those as well! Now that I think about it, when I ran my 41TC (same basic layout as a 58TC) I would just lift the stairs leading down into the galley and barely stick my head in there for my hourly ER checks. I'd do a quick visual, and shoot my IR thermometer gun at the oil filter or oil pan on the mains and genny to check oil temps, shoot the coolant expansion tanks to check water temps and button it up until next hour. I actually used to write down my findings on a sheet of paper that was set up with fill in the blanks for these values. That way I could see what the temps were doing hour by hour over time. After rarely seeing any differences, I stopped that practice. I must say that opening a door while standing upright sure is easier though, take it from someone who has experience with both.

As far as Carl not sounding like a Yachtsman, have no fear. You are in NO DANGER either "Bubba"!