0f Diesel in a gas engined Hat!

[Maynard Rupp]

Biy I did a real dumb testerday. I asked the guy at the gas dock for gasoline, but their are so few gas boats in Florida,(and very few diesels in the Great Lakes), I guess the guy wasn't listening and handed me a hose. If you think you can tell by the smell, I am here to tell you differently. It smelled like gas, owing to the fact that what you really are smelling is the vapors coming from the tank. So, I bought 60 gallons of diesel and it mixed with 300 gallons of gas to give me a full tank. It ran fine for about an hour, then the starboard engine started to backfire and drop RPM. The port engine ran fine for the entire trip to Ft. Meyers Beach. When we arrived and checking everything I could think of, I asked my wife for the gas slip. 60 gallons @$2.29 told me the whole story. Most "experts" said it isn't a problem. So far I have checked compression and all are within 5 lbs. of 145. That is good. Each engine had a little more than twice as much oil in the pan as they should have. I guess this happens when the cylinder preassure is low during combustion and the fuel leaks by the piston rings. Now I will change all oil, filters, fuel filters, spark plugs, and have the tank pumped out. Have I forgotten anything? Any other thoughts from any of our resident experts would be appreciated.

 

[yachtsmanbill]

After you change everything, run a serious dose of gas line anti freeze to suck up any residual water. #2 has about .01-.05% water in it. Its the nature of the beast. At least your valves got a good lube job out of this!!
Back in'73 some gas stations here got pinched for diluting the gas with F.O. It was about $.07 a gallon versus 29.9. Man how times have changed ! ws

 

[SKYCHENEY]

Sorry to hear that, Maynard. But I"ll bet it never happens again. I think your on the right track. Change the oil, filters and plugs and then get them back on straight gasoline and you should be okay. Glad you made it to your destination and didn't have to get a tow.

 

[Boatsb]

Call them at the maina and have them pick up and fix the boat. Have them drain the tanks enough to get the mixture of diesel low enough to run. 10% would be my guess.

Its interesting the engines have way too much oil as the unburned fuel should have gone out as smoke. Do you have FI or carbs?

 

[Boss Lady]

My Dad told me about using diesel and kerosene as gas extenders during WWII. They would crank the engines on gas and then switch over to kerosene and run them on straight #1. They also mixed #2 with the gas, but they also had to clean the plugs often since they would foul quickly and they spark system was very weak back then. He used to show off this mini sandblaster that was a small wooden box with a canvas bag attached and a hole for the spark plug, you just hit it with an air hose and viola, clean spark plug. He could make a spark plug last for years. LOL

P.S. you only added 20% diesel I don't see that as a major issue. Are these computer controlled or good old carburation? I would change the oil and then check oil pressures if you think you had fuel diluting the oil. I made the same mistake on our farm truck (carbureted, I couldn't comment on an EFI) years ago, it ran rough and it did smoke a lot! But once we ran the fuel level down far enough to add more gas it cleaned up and ran fine. But we were not running boat RPMs either.

 

[Bob Bradley]

Not much consolation, but it could have been worse.

2 examples:

Met a guy on a ski trip in France who had just put gasoline in his diesel Rabbit. Bye Bye engine.

Had another friend who put the gas fill nozzle into his rod holder and poured 20 gallons or so of gasoline into his bilge before realizing it. Fortunately didn't go boom, but it was not a cheap fix.

 

[Boss Lady]

I once had a Rabbit diesel, and VW recommended adding several gallons of gasoline for winter operation. The gasoline helped control gelling of the fuel and definitely aided combustion. I guess if you added too much gas you would melt some pistons.

 

[Beckytek]

It's not as bad as putting about 50 gallons of fuel oil in your water tank as I once did. Ron

 

[yachtsmanbill]

Twenty some odd years ago on a 4th of July weekend we were in a very busy Dresden lock on the Ill river when some yoyo's gas tank split open and filled his bilge. The pump kicked on and pumped about 10 gallons of gas into the chamber which promptly covered the whole lock with a layer of gasoline.
That one prompted the fastest lockage Ive ever seen. I'm glad the lockmaster was paying attention. Could've turned into a real gas chamber What were the chances of surviving that one??
Swore I'd own a diesel boat one day... ws

 

[Trojan]

The old cars, boat engines and tractors with the long stroke cranks. could stand the mix of gas and diesel mixed together. Our one tractor would start on gas then once it reached temperature you would turn a valve and switch over to diesel. Engines of today can't stand the low octane, advanced timing along with the short stroke and high rpms. There is not time enough for the fuel to burn in the cylinders nor enough heat to keep it burning.


BILL

 

[garyd]

Fortunately or not don't feel bad we have all done some dumb things. I would communicate with the marina that helped botch it. They may at least give you some free fuel next time bye. But in Florida most marinas make you pump it yourself for that very reason.

During WWII they use to dilute oil in the oil tank with gasoline in very cold climates just before shutdown. After start up the gasoline would evaporate and you would end up with just oil. So maybe your oil situation didn't cause any long term damage.

As far as the diesel in the gas if it started at 20% and you've already burned off a fair amount then maybe the next fill up puts it less than 10% and your on your way. I know we have some chemists on the forum so maybe they could shed some light as too how the diesel mixed with the gas. Diesel is heavier than gas so did it go to the bottom of the tank. Or does it mix perfectly with gas to create a new solution. If it's a little of both then I would say your out of the woods. Draining the tank may not be neccessary.

If it were me I'd change all filters clean the offending carb, refill the fuel tanks with GAS rock the boat back and forth to slosh the fuel around. Run it in the slip for a couple of hours refill and be on my way.

Good luck garyd

 

[Maynard Rupp]

Call them at the maina and have them pick up and fix the boat. Have them drain the tanks enough to get the mixture of diesel low enough to run. 10% would be my guess.

Its interesting the engines have way too much oil as the unburned fuel should have gone out as smoke. Do you have FI or carbs?

Good old quadrajunk carbs.

 

[Maynard Rupp]

The old cars, boat engines and tractors with the long stroke cranks. could stand the mix of gas and diesel mixed together. Our one tractor would start on gas then once it reached temperature you would turn a valve and switch over to diesel. Engines of today can't stand the low octane, advanced timing along with the short stroke and high rpms. There is not time enough for the fuel to burn in the cylinders nor enough heat to keep it burning.


BILL

That sounds like the reason that we at least doubled the amount of oil in each engines oil pan.

 

[Boatsb]

Quadrajets are easy to clean up. Better that the other option of Fuel Injection. It should be easy to clean the fuel system out justget lots of plugs for the next few hours running.

If you go to a hotter plug ( temporarly ) it should burn the diesel but dont leave them in.

 

[Maynard Rupp]

Quadrajets are easy to clean up. Better that the other option of Fuel Injection. It should be easy to clean the fuel system out justget lots of plugs for the next few hours running.

If you go to a hotter plug ( temporarly ) it should burn the diesel but dont leave them in.

I am draining every drop of that stuff, so I anticipate that the new plugs will be OK. I have shut the fuel valve from the tank and cranked the engines in the process of checking compression. That won't drain the carbs, but will remove most of that stuff. i don't plan on taking the carbs off or apart unless you guys think I have to. All other fuel carrying lines will be drained. Fortunately, I never ran the gen set.

 

[Boatsb]

Small amounts of diesel will not hurt the engines. Probably even help them some as we used to fog engines all the time up north for storage. If you pull the fuel from the lines you will be getting clean fuel to the carbs. From that point I would get them running and just run the fuel from the carbs at high idle for a few minutes till its clean.

Did you pull the oil yet? I am curiuous as to how much is in each crankcase. Did it take in another 3-4 quarts? That was the part in your post that made me wonder. Thats a lot of extra oil if it is what you posted first.

For the gas dock not being responsible I would argue the fact that even if you pump it yourself. The attendant was the one who gave you the wrong pump. If you asked for Gas and he handed you the diesel pump it was his mistake. Half the time when fueling I cant see the pump because its 40 feet down the dock and 2 boats away.

 

[jim rosenthal]

Maynard- don't do a thing. I'll send you two diesel engines as fast as I can. You're on your way to a repower. Just make sure you drain all the gasoline out of your tanks and complete your diesel fillup. LOL

Actually, when I had a 240D years ago they had in the manual to put kerosene in the tank in the winter to avoid the fuel gelling up. Is it getting cold down there?

OK, enough, I'll lay off.

 

[yachtsmanbill]

Our gas turbines ran on natural gas and No.2, Our GE LM5000 areo derivitves used home heating oil, and for a winter blend we mixed in some JP-5 (?) ; kerosene with gas for gelling and altitude--FLYERS?? ws

 

[Pascal]

hi Maynard.... sorry about your blonde moment!

yeah, the guy should have handed over the right hose, what i don't understand is why don't marina have big DIESEL or GAS labels on the nozzles ! some use color coded nozoles that are dirty and faded... i mean, you buy an appliance and it comes with a shole bunch of lables about using it your swimming pool... but no labels on nozzles ?


a carb'd engine should be fine... a few years back during a car club drive a friend of mine filled up his E-type with diesel... the V12 and the 3 Strombergs cars handled it pretty well, it was billowing grey smoke but running. after a a few miles he was able to find a place to drain the tank (has a nice sump)... no damage done.

 

[Boatsb]

Just so you all know there is more to converting to Diesel than just filling the tanks.