Help-Generator trouble on vacation in Bahamas

[garyd]

Northern Lights 8kw 1999. It has always worked perfect. It struggled and quit. So I changed Fuel filters but the problem continues.

It is repeatable here goes.

It will run for 1 minute and 45 seconds. Then starts to die for 5 seconds a little then comes back and tries to die for 5 seconds then comes back and the third time tries to die again and sometimes does then it comes back strong only to repeat this every 1 minute and 45 seconds it does it consitantly over and over again.

I can put a full load on it during the time it is running normally without a problem.

It will do the same thing with or without the generator circuit breaker on.

I thought it might be fuel related like a plugged pick up but the timing is too perfect.

If you stop it during the dying cycle it has a hard time starting. If you stop it when it is running normally it starts normally. I can't get a good enough internet connection to bring up NL's site to search for a solution.

We are at Sampson cay club marina in the Exumas. WE are only going to be here a couple of more days then we start our way back Home. But being from Bradenton we have about 500 NM to travel and I sure would like to get it fixed for the journey.

Any Help would be apreciated.

Thanks garyd

[MikeP]

Sure SOUNDS like a fuel issue. That timing thing is just what a restricted fuel supply would do - run normally until the existing fuel flow is overcome by the engine's use of the fuel.

Do you have a separate primary (racor, whatever) as well as the genny-mounted filter? If so, did you change both? Try putting the genny's fuel pick-up hose into a container of diesel fuel and see what happens, that will at least prove that it either is or is not a fuel supply issue.

Any fuel valves that could have been accidentally moved to the off or nearly off position?

That is what I would do if it was me.

It's possible that some sort of electrical problem is causing a shut-off signal to be sent to the fuel solenoid but I have no expertise in the circuitry involved. But you could also attempt to bypass the shutoff relay...

[Finalee]

Sure sounds like fuel. Try disconnecting the fuel supply at the filter and blow back into it. If some gunk is hanging on the pick up it will restrict the flow, as the rpms drop the fuel requirement drops. The fuel will be replenished and the cycle starts again.

[Captned]

Another fuel guy on the bandwagon. Try and bypass all fuel filters and run direct to see if it helps. Just long enough to test...

Sure wish I was in Sampson....

Captned
78 46 CON

[Genesis]

Sounds like a fuel restriction to me too. Probably some crap over the pickup in the tank.

Put an air line on the line going to the tank (disconnect before the filter) and blow it backwards. Then reconnect, re-prime (run the electric lift pump if you have one; on my Kohler this was done by disconnecting the starter solenoid lead and hitting the start button - the fuel pump would run but the unit would not crank) until it has fuel, and see if that fixes it.

[Brian Degulis]

Garyd sure sounds like fuel starvation or shut down or fuel on solenoid. Run a temparary fuel line from the pumps suction into a container of fuel and see if the problem is on the suction side. If it still dies out then look to the solenoids you probably have a fuel supply solenoid instead of a shutdown. Some where on the injection pump there should be something with one or two wires on it probably just one. It should be energized to run try a jumper to check the circuit. Most fuel on solenoids have a way of overiding them if they fail.

Brian

[garyd]

Thanks guys your the best. I can remove the hose from the pick up. It should be easy as it is located in the cockpit with a cover that gives plenty of access. The pick up tube could also be removed but I'm concerned that I might break it then I'd be SOL. I think I can use two wrenches and the old squeeze technique to get the hose off.

Brian I did find what I believe is a fuel solenoid and it has a single wire going to it. So in the morning I can start there and see what happens. Then continue down the fuel path if that doesn't get it done. I have two filters a racor 500 then an engine mounted "oil filter " type. I changed both and can see the glass bowl of the racor is clean.

This Marina is Upscale and If I started the genereator in the middle of the night they would probably faint. Every boat in here looks like it just rolled off the showroom floor. Most folks are giving their boats a $100.00 bath as they use water like it's going out of style and are paying 50 cents a gallon. Heck I told my crew get wet lather up and then rinse. The old navy shower.

I'll be up early and get right at it. This is the first spot I have been able to get the internet to work on my wireless laptop. It is slow and drops off a lot.

The model of the generator is a Norhern lights PX 303.

Fuel has gone up over a dollar a gallon since we started the trip. And most places do not have fuel. We are going slowwwwwww. LOL.

Thanks again I'll try to let you know what works to fix it.

garyd

[Genesis]

If the solenoid is a "pull to run" deal then that could be the issue - the coil may have an intermittent in it and when it gets warm it drops out.

If so its easy - if it drops out and everything else is ok (oil pressure, temperature, etc) hold it in and it should continue to run if that's the problem.

The issue with doing that as a way to keep the genset going is that you've just defeated all the safety systems. If the oil pressure goes or the unit overheats with the solenoid "hard pulled" (e.g. with a tie wrap or similar) you're hosed - it won't shut down.

I had an Onan genset that had this sort of arrangement when I bought my Hatt - it had a dual coil; one start winding to pull it in and one "run" winding to hold it. I never had trouble with it (the unit failed for other reasons and I replaced it due to age and general condition) but there was a spare solenoid on board when I bought the boat and the one on the genset looked pretty new - apparently the previous owner had a spit of trouble with it at some point in the past.

[garyd]

Well it ran for a good 10-12 hours, then started the same thing. It will now run for a while then shut down or go real low. It is something we can live with as we only need to keep the frig cold and it lasts almost 10 hours with no 115v. So if we can give a shot of two hours of 115v now and then we good. We should only have one more night out on the hook so 1 night might be a little warm but we had had cool relative 80 degrees east winds at night.

I'm going to repeat my clean process on the main filter now we are somewhere I can dump the garbage of soaked diesel paper towels etc etc. Maybe that we get it going again for 10-12 hours and we can have AC tonight.

One of the other cruisers said he had read an article that the low ash in diesel fuel these days is having an effect on O rings. Apparently the ash would get absorbed by the o rings and swell helping them to seal. Now with the low ash the O rings are reverting back to their old size and leaks are appearing in the form of air leaks in boats. HMMMMM

Got me stumpted I've cleaned blew through and bypassed almost everything and made sure everything was tight.

garyd

[the kuz]

One more thing to check when you get back is the pick up tube. I have had 2 go bad (one one the port engine and one on the genny). They are made of rigid copper and are soldered to the pick up fitting that screws into the top of the tank. When manufactured, they were apparently clamped in a vise, because mine had witness marks and a slightly flat spot. After 25-30 years of being stressed by vibration and sloshing fuel, 2 of mine developed a hairline crack near the point where the vise clamped down. It was so fine that you could not see it unless you put side pressure on the tube so it opened up. Anyway when the fuel got down below the crack, air would be sucked in and the the gen/moter would slow down/stop. Full tank it ran normal. I checked for air leaks at every fitting from the motor back until I got to the tank - what a project. Anyway the tube is something you would never think could fail, especially in that mode. So, if you have an air leak into the fuel that you can't locate, it is worth a check. I made a piece of clear tube with fittings that I rigged to a small 12v fuel pump. Inserted in the line and sucked fuel into a container. Might be an easier way, but that showed the air bubbles. Made replacements and all has been fine for several years.
Good luck, Bob K