Blue Note repower thread

[jim rosenthal]

This may be a little premature, but I thought I would start a thread which shows what Zimmerman Marine Inc. is doing on Blue Note's repower. Since we have a number of owners with similar boats, at least one of whom is doing something similar, I thought it might be useful. Please post if you have specific questions about what they are doing and how they are doing it. I will try to get info and photos as I am able to.

Current status: boat is hauled at ZMI- I visited yesterday and got my tools, linens, food etc off the boat. Also got the tour of ZMI.
They seem to be a well-organized group. There is a project coordinator for each job, and each job has a binding estimate, which they are working on completing now. (I will probably post this, or a summary thereof, when they are done). The estimate is put together by the technician who will do the work; he breaks the job down into the various elements of it, and assigns a number in hours plus the cost of the various materials he will use. The estimate is reviewed etc before it is submitted to the customer.
Their questions for me were: would I get them the engineering drawings (the installation ones) for the 370D engines, and some concerns about the boat's stringers and where the previous mounts were. This is a legit concern since after a while, if you've drilled enough holes down into the metal plate glassed into the stringer, you end up with more holes than plate. And nothing for the engine bearers to hang on to. Also whether the new engines would just bolt to the ZF gears in their current position, which I think/hope they will. (I referred them to boatdiesel.com which has drawings from Cummins)

ZMI builds boats from bare hulls made to their design by Spencer Lincoln (in Rhode Island, I think); currently under construction are a ZMI 46, which barely fits in the large shed, and a ZMI 36 which is waiting, I think, for the 46 to get done. They have also built a few one-off sailboats, including a ~50 ft cold-molded sailboat called 'Chanty'. I saw this boat at a boat show years ago (evidently the only one she ever went to) and also on the cover of Wooden Boat magazine. They built her from top to bottom, stem to stern, and she is absolutely the most beautifully made sailboat I have ever seen. If you love boats, even if you are not a sailor, you cannot fail to be moved by the sight of this vessel. It has the most magnificent yacht joinery and finish work you will ever behold. They do not work on convertibles, MYs or SFs very much- There is no other Hatteras in the yard, and Blue Note is the only convertible in there. Lots of GBs and Nordhavns in and out, though.

Their approach is more methodical and organized than the local yards I have dealt with before, although several of those have done good work on Blue Note. Also, they do everything to ABYC code, which although it may make things cost more, does provide some additional protection to the boat both in terms of how systems are constructed and also insurance liability. As soon as I have see the finished quote and approved it, they will get started.

I don't have a lot of photos right now- but there's not much to see yet. Also I have to figure out how to reduce the size of photos, as the ones they sent me are too large.
Interestingly, they use a hydraulic trailer to haul boats and move them around. Most of their business is large cruising trawlers and sailboats which weigh quite a bit more than Blue Note- this allows them to store boats very close together which lets them use the storage space more efficiently.

We are not off and running yet, but are close, I hope. The underwater gear seems in good shape (just covered with barnacles like everyone else's boat this year). I will post additional stuff as it comes, good and bad, and as always I welcome your comments or inquiries as to how things are going. If, in this process, some useful information can get put up for all, that would be a plus.

[whaler23]

Jim, Look forward to the update and photos, please! What about the engine room itself when your old motors are pulled? Awlgrip, Imron, rewire, movement or relocation of any mechanicals? Enjoyed my tour of your boat the other week and look forward to a ride with the new motors.

[jim rosenthal]

Actually, I painted the engine room when the repower was done years ago. We will probably just clean up what's there, and do selective repainting of the areas that need it.

It's always the "while-you're-in-theres" that get you on a job like this. For example, I think that the shaft alley bearings and strut bearings are okay...but if they turn out not to be, they get replaced this time around. The DC wiring and all the plumbing should be okay. If I can afford it, I am going to ask for those fancy blue silicone exhaust hoses. The genset and other mechanicals are pretty much where they ought to be and AFAIK they are all okay. There will be some cleaning up, no doubt, but hopefully not a lot of relocation to do.

In my boat, as in a lot of ours, things have been added along the way. One of the things that may happen is that ZMI will take a look at everything that needs to go back in there, and come up with a more-user friendly way to do it all. For example, the service points on cummins diesels can be set up so that all the oil and filter changes can be done from the middle of the engine room. Given my increasing girth and the small size of the 36C ER, this would be good. Also, there is an oil-change system, genset fuel filter, mains fuel filters, etc, that all have to go back in there. They will probably have suggestions about how to organize this so it is easier to work with. Fine with me. But there's only so much you can do with a small space like that, and all these mechanicals.

[34Hatt]

Jim what are you doing about packing glans staying with what you have or dripless if you didn't have them already can't remember?
Also the Big question do they have a plan yet for exhaust are they going to have dry riser's??
If not I would do surge tubes and flapper's.
Also change the front mount next to the pump like Athens say's, I did not and already regret it .

[jim rosenthal]

Dan, when we put the Caterpillars in we installed PSS shaft seals. They have worked fine so far; I will just have them review those and make sure everything is okay.
We are looking at the motor mount issue; I have a photo of one of Tony's mounts, which cradles the front of the engine and allows you to change the seawater pump. His concerns are well-founded.

ZMI wants to have elbows made of Inconel, which they like for longevity in applications involving hot seawater. I have a drawing from Slane's group that shows the piece they use for this application. We'll see how this all works out. I am not a fan of flappers, but may be willing to use them if need be. The drawing that I have shows a dry riser with the injection point on the way downhill. There also needs to be room for pyrometer probes as well.

[34Hatt]

Sounds good Jim
I too have the PSS seal the paper work says change the boot every 6 years, How old are yours now might be a good time since your there.

Exhaust sounds like they have a good plan and you won't need the flappers.

I already did my mounts prior to finding Tony's comments on the mount . But I only have a few small things the rest I am happy with and I can't wait to here your comments on the difference between the two engines .

[surfdancer45]

Jim: I have put comments in several threads about my stringer problems when I had the Cummins 300s installed. The hull was flexing from the high torque from these engines and as a result the top of the engine would move about 2 inches. The engines were removed and the stringers were reinforced and a couple of cross grids added. No problems since the repair. I believe your Blue Note is a couple of years younger than Samurai so you may not have the problem. I know you will like the Cummins in that hull. Good luck with your project. Bob

[Banshee36]

Jim,
As far as the exhaust. I got all the figerglass pipe, silicone hose , clamps and such from Oceana. I even ordered 6 inch surge tubes, and made everything work.
As far as the Athens engine mount , I have not seen these.I will suggest that you use the Caterpiller engine mounts and not the Cummins , unless they fixed them. I had all mine replaced with Caterpillers.

Changing the impellers is a PITA on the cummins, as well as the water pump. but it can be done just takes a a little time.
Good luck.

Also I am not sure where your genset is, But I placed mine in between the engine aft. Freed up some romm for toher things.

JW

[jim rosenthal]

JW, my genset is already aft between the stringers. The exhausts may work as they are; they are 6" FRP tubes, probably from Trident or whoever makes them...the Athens engine mount avoids the issue of being unable to change out the seawater pump without removing the engine mount.

As far as the torque goes, the peak torque on the 3116s is nearly 800 ft/lbs, so it can't be that different. I have not noticed hull flexing but I will watch for it when we seatrial the boat.

[the kuz]

Jim,I'm pretty new to the forum, but also have a series one 36C (1977) repowered with Cummins 330s last year at Tolchester here on the bay. I have lots in process of engine room pictures if you are interested and I can figure out how to post them. Would also be glad to share lessons learned, costs, and discuss pros/cons of work done on Baby Grand. We keep her at home on a creek off the lower Potomac. You will love the repower - like a new boat! Regards, Bob Kuzmick