What big expenses can happen to a 48 ACMY?

[bobk]

The 1981 48' series I MY I have an offer on has had a lot done to it in the current owners time. Engines were re-built, turbo's redone twice, complete new exhaust including risers, elbows, 'Y' pipes, exhaust tubes and mufflers etc. This all sounds good, but for a 2000 hour boat, one worries. (My trawler with a single 135 HP Ford has 3300 hours and has only needed changing some minor bolt on stuff.)

I know I have some fiberglass repairs to the aft deck hard-top and window replacements ahead of me that will cost about $15,000 or so and I need to put some real money into heavy duty ground tackle for cruising. We will take her from the Chesapeake to the Florida Keys every year until we are too old or feeble. Some think I'n nuts to be doing this at age 70.

My question is what else might happen to the engines or ships systems that will cost an arm and a leg? And please include your estimates of repair costs for any of these things. Are these Hatteras' more expensive than most to own? Our budget does have limits.

Bob

[Banshee36]

Hand grenaded engines come to mind when one asks for big expenses.
JW

[SeaEric]

Hatteras Yachts in general are more expensive to maintain than many others. Example: they are painted instead of gel-coat. That said, most owners figure the quality is well worth the investment.

As far as expensive repairs: pick anything. All the major components are expensive to rebuild or replace. Despite the best of care and maintenance, things break and stuff goes wrong. After all, its a boat. Something that has worked flawlessly for years suddenly and without warning, crumbles in your hand.

The boats that are maintained on a tight budget are those that when offered for sale, the buyers curse the seller for their lack of proper care of the boat. Certainly what goes around, comes around.

[Genesis]

My experience is that when it comes to cosmetics Hatts can be more expensive to keep in "top" appearance, BUT to keep them in "good" appearance is actually cheaper than most other boats - simply because on some you CAN'T keep them in good appearance!

For example, many boats are made with a gelcoat that afer 10 years can't be compounded back to a nice shine. It just can't. So you're stuck with a dull finish. A Hatt's paint will eventually start to chalk, but when it does, believe it or not, you can actually use a paste wax with a buffer and bring it back many times before you're stuck with a repaint job.

So the "absolute best" finish is more expensive to maintain on the Hatt - initially. But in the end, it can actually be LESS expensive.

Engines are engines. The rest is really a matter of engineering. For a boat with the same set of systems, the Hatt wins on the maintenance cost, simply because the engineering is typically better. You don't see Hatts with weak strut attachments - a VERY expensive problem if you have it happen. You also don't see them with crap wiring (unless someone made a mess out of it as a previous owner), which again, can be VERY expensive to sort out. Many other boats are lacking in these areas.

The big deal is really in the propulsion. Cosmetics are, all things equal, cheap to take care of. You can completely GUT the interior of one of these boats and re-do it for what a pair of majors will cost on the engines. That sounds like a lot, but its a hell of a lot more than you get with an "inframe major" in terms of how much of the boat has to be monkeyed with!

The probelm is that if you pay someone to do the maintenance on the engines you have two risks - one, its very expensive to have done right, and two, they may STILL do it wrong. Either way YOU pay, of course, which is bad all the way around.

My view is that you want to do as much of the maintenance on those systems YOURSELF as you can. There's a money issue here, but there's also a QUALITY OF WORK issue. If you want to pay someone to do the interior, or varnish the brightwork, or paint the boat, that's fine. I pay for bottom jobs, for example. But when it comes to the engines I do my own work - I know the motors, I know what kind of shape they're in, what they need, and when.

Don't underestimate carrying costs. They're real, and if you don't spend the money then the boat will literally turn to dust around you.

The "chestnut" is that you should expect to spend 10% of the purchase price annually on carrying costs. There will be years that you can get away with less, but you better sock it back, because there will also be years when you need to spend the reserve you built!

[CapetaniosG]

Your question is not easy to answer with a high degree of certainty. No one can predict what may happen to a boat as complex as the Hatteras 48 ACMY. There are too many variables for someone to predict what may happen. There are mechanical, electrical and hydraulic systems in these type of boats , among others, that need constant attention and maintenance and that may include complete replacement of components.

You say that the boat is a 2000 hour boat. That does not tell me much. Is it original hours or since MOH of the engines? Makes a difference. Was the overhaul of the engines a complete overhaul or just, say, changing pistons or piston rings either complete or partial on both engines? To know that, you must see official paid invoices that the present owner will be glad to produce.
These invoices must show the specific engine components that were changed with new ones. Cancelled checks will also tell you that the seller is telling you the truth. Who did the overhaul? Was he a factory authorized mechanic or one of those roaming the docks looking for suckers?

Regardless what the seller is telling you have a factory authorized mechanic perform a complete engine survey. If the engines are DD's have the local DD
dealer perform the survey not the mechanic you met on the dock this morning. Obtain a written engine survey report, study it and understand it. Any corrective actions recommended make it the responsibility of the seller to corect before you buy or better yet reduce the selling price for at least double the cost of repairs and have a qualified mechanic do it for you.

With all that it does not mean that after you buy the boat you can relax that everything is ok. It may not be unless you're religiously checking your engines and do the maintenance required.

Most problems, however, on a boat of this size and type and every boat for that matter are not mechanical but electrical. Have a qualified MARINE Electrician examine the electrical system to ensure it meets minimum industry standards. Correct any defects found. Boats have gone up in flames due to a rusted connection on one of their electrical systems.

A rotten balsa core in the deck or around window frames can be very expensive to repair. Have your marine surveyor tell you if there are such areas and fix them before you buy.

You should know that even with a complete survey of the boat and its systems it does not mean that down the road you will not incur some big expense. You may despite your best efforts to avoid it. Tha's the nature of the beast in boating. Good luck.

CapetaniosG

Hatteras 53 MY
Southold, NY/ Rhodes, Greece

[jim rosenthal]

Cost of 36 convertible, in 1992. $30K
Cost of diesel repower, $45K
Cost of Interlux bottom job, $10K
Cost of paint job, w/ incidentals, $20K
...and that's just the big chunks; there are a lot of small ones such as radios, sounders, interior decor, electrical upgrades, etc- what my friend Alex Dearborn calls the "while you're in theres"...another $30K at least.

Being at a dock in St. Michaels, MD, next to a 85' modern megayacht, whose owner leans over the rail and says "that's the prettiest Hatteras I've ever seen"...
Having SOUNDINGS run an illustrated article on the restoration of my boat...

..PRICELESS.

Bottom line? here it is: spending a lot of money and time won't guarantee you great memories, but spending nothing will guarantee you the lack of them.

[Nonchalant1]

Bob,

Big expenses? Just running her will be one:
Distance from Chesapeake to Key West = 1,100 NM
Round trip = 2,200 NM
Times 2 gal per NM = 4,400 gal. of diesel (could be 3,500 going slow)
Times $3.20 per gal (probably way low for the next 10 years) = $14,000 per year.
Overnights and transient slips at marinas for 100 nights every winter, allowing for lots of anchoring out, X $1.50/ft X 50 ft. LOA = $7,500 per year.
Routine maintenance if you do i t yourself = $1,500 per year (maybe arguably low est.)
Surprise maintenance which always come up = $2,000 per year, (if you stay off the reefs OK).
Stuff I forgot to include, like hauling and bottom scraping & painting = $2,000 per year.
I won't count food and tequilla since you'd be consuming that anyway.
Total so far = $27,000 per year
I'll give you to 83 to get feeble, since you'll be working on a Hatteras, so 13 years times $27K/yr....
EQUALS $350,000 TOTAL. I'd call that a major expense.

But worth every penny, so do it!

After all, your next 13 years are the most important ones because you won't be able to have this much fun after 83 or so.

Doug Shuman

[bobk]

Great answers gentlemen. Those things like fuel, paint, 'routine' maintenance, food and booze are not surprises in my book. I'm going to do them. This boat will be home most of the year. What I was concerned about are things like what happens to the trannys? If one goes south, is it 2K or 10K? And how likely is that?

The last one of these I surveyed needed all cutless bearings and possible struts, rudder bearings, new alternator at a huge price which this forum says was way inflated. The boat looked beautiful inside, but we worried about maintenance. Just wondering what may be ahead. This one seems to have good maintenance but what seemed like more need for repairs than I'm used to, hence the questions.

Engines (6V92 425 hp) have 450 hrs on what seems to be good in-frame majors, but we have the question of possible soot ingestion which I hope the survey will not see any problems with, or maybe a better result will be it finds trashed engines and I get a price concession.

[bobk]

Great answers gentlemen. Those things like fuel, paint, 'routine' maintenance, food and booze are not surprises in my book. I'm going to do them. This boat will be home most of the year. What I was concerned about are things like what happens to the trannys? If one goes south, is it 2K or 10K? And how likely is that?

The last one of these I surveyed needed all cutless bearings and possible struts, rudder bearings, new alternator at a huge price which this forum says was way inflated. The boat looked beautiful inside, but we worried about maintenance. Just wondering what may be ahead. This one seems to have good maintenance but what seemed like more need for repairs than I'm used to, hence the questions.

Engines (6V92 425 hp) have 450 hrs on what seems to be good in-frame majors, but we have the question of possible soot ingestion which I hope the survey will not see any problems with, or maybe a better result will be it finds trashed engines and I get a price concession.

[garyd]

I'm sure you're going to get or do a comprehesive survey including engines.

In order not to get suprised by $$$$, when you take her on a sea trail, run her as hard as the owner will let you without crossing the abuse line.

If the owner will not let you run her hard he is hiding something, Walk away.

Make sure everything is running fine. I would take a pair of ear muffs and spend some time under full power in the engine room while the captain was making some S turns. When I do this I often think what the heck am I doing? However this is essential if you don't like surprises. Nothing short of about a 2-3 hour very hard test run to make sure she is A .O.K. if your paying good $$$$$ she should be GOOD!

DO YOUR HOMEWORK! I ALWAYS START DOWN THE PATH THAT EVERTHING IS NOT GOOD AND MAKE THE VESSEL PROVE ME WRONG!

Don't get emotional until you own her then O.K. beam a little but not beforehand!

There is a lot to look for that we have discussed several times on this forum. Don't take it lightly. If the owner is resonable, some are and some are not then he will appreciate your due diligence. After you have a completed notebook with pictures showing all the good bad and ugly associate costs with each. Some no big deal. some have to be done even if he keeps the boat and doesn't sell it. Some are important to you but not to him.

Ask to discuss each item in detail. Then make your final offer. He will know you are serious and again most of the time will have had as mush fun as you during the process.

If you do this process well and don't run her aground she should not cost you an arm and a leg to maintain.

Have Fun Boating garyd