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Bertellini
03-16-2013, 11:40 AM
I am looking at several of these models ranging in age from 1974 to 1984. Most of the browsing I have done on this and other sites seem to confirm that both are very highly praised for their quality of construction, see keeping abilities, and general owner satisfaction. My question is how do these models differ? According to the timeline of production, there was only one year of overlap when both were produced, and Hatteras switched back and forth for this ten year run and forward to the last one of either in 1994: 45C from '68-'75, 46C from '74-'84', 45C from '84-'92, and then the 46C from '92-'94. Are they identical hulls with different designs from the stringers up? What are the pros and cons of each model?

saltshaker
03-16-2013, 12:42 PM
45C series I and the 46C series I are very similar and share the same hull. The 46 is an updated version of the 45. Bigger bridge and taller ER other than that pretty much the same boat. The 46 had some changes around '82. The layout was changed a bit and the HP version became available. Bigger engines, a shorter keel, and increased fuel capacity are a few of the changes. These are refered to as the 46C series II. The 45 series II is a stretched 43C. The extra 2ft is all in the cockpit. The 45C is a good boat but IMO doesn't compare to the 46C, particularly the 46HP. The 46C is a much better sea boat, has a better interior layout, bigger ER and carries more fuel. The 46C series III is a good boat but not very popular. She's heavy and thirsty. I don't fish but my understanding is that the 46C III wasn't popular due to her cockpit dimensions. The deck is too high from the water and the gunnels are too high on the inside making her less fisherman friendly. I'd opt for a 48C instead. All of these boats are still great boats but offer different things. For me a 46HP or a 48C would be the best choice. The 48C is a fantastic boat but she's much bigger and thirstier than the others. The 46HP offers the most for your money and good ones are out there. If you like the 45C II, look for an '87 or newer one and unless you find a repowered one, make sure you have the 6V92TA's with the wet turbos. Which ever you choose, buy the best one you can find for your budget. $100-$125K will get you a good one and if you're lucky and a smart shopper maybe a great one.

Bertellini
03-17-2013, 10:44 AM
Thanks for the breakdown and analysis, it certainly clears up my confusion. You seem to be very knowledgable of the Hatteras line from what I've seen you post on other threads. Any thoughts on the 41C II? It is on my list since there are a few close to me that are in great shape and priced aggressively. The front runner is an '87 with 6-71s that has been shed kept for most of its life.

saltshaker
03-17-2013, 07:15 PM
The 41C II is a good boat but I think you'd be better off with a 46C or 45C. The 41C needs a bit of HP to keep her going and the 671's won't give you much performance. If you like the 41C look for one with 6V92TA's. Performance on these boats seems to be all over the place. Some complain about how slow they are while others get a good turn of speed out of them. A lot has to do with how they are loaded. Some had wedges glassed in to give them lift and keep the bow down. Unless you find a real pristine one that's priced right, I'd think you'd do better with a 46HP or 87 or newer 45C. Where are you located? I know of a real nice 41C with fresh 6V92's on the west coast of FL. She's been on the market a while and the owner was very unrealistic on price. I know he's missed out on a few boats because he didn't have this one sold. He may be ready to talk but who knows.

capttonyf
03-18-2013, 01:23 PM
I agree with Saltshaker on his analysis. Either the 46 1979 or newer or the 45 Series II would be great boats it just depends on whats more important to you. If you went with the 45 I would look for a 89 to 93 because they have the updated Window Look, The Bridge Console, but most importantly the interior Layout. They gave it an S curve companionway with a Larger Master Stateroom and a 2nd head. The only other years they offered a 2nd head was in 1987 on the Short Lived Palm Beach Addition. There is a repowered 89 in the keys but must be an early 1989 because it still has the older layout and there is a really nice looking 1990 in Coconut Grove "Miami" thats been updated and looks nice. I personally have a 1990 45 Conv because I prefererd the Larger/Longer Cockpit. The 45 has about 10 more square feet than the 46 but to me feels much larger. Plus when I was purchasing mine there just seemed to be a better selection of nice cond 45's at that time. I also liked the Offset Angle Master Bedroom. I would have been happy with either of the 2 Models as both are very similar in ride, speed, and obviosly quality of construction and at giving you a nice dry SOLID ride in just about all cond. I was a professional delivery Capt for years and ran just about every brand/size of boat made and Hatteras is the Brand I choose to purchase for personal use. There are other quality faster boats of this era, size, and price range such as 45 Vikings, 43 Egg Harbors, 43 to 46 Post's and they are all good boats but when the weather gets a little snotty they just dont feel as solid and your forced to back them down a little. People will bring up ride of 42 to 46 Bertrams's and they're right but the fit, finish and interior attention to detail just don't compare to the Hatt. My 45 has 535hp.6V92's and at 1950 rpm 20 to 21Knts at 2000rpm 22Knts and WOT 2350 26Knts. For family Cruising/Fishing 21knts is plenty fast and safe in just about all conditions on these old Hatts. Everyone wants to talk about SPEED and a 30+ knt cruise and with my kids/family on board those speeds are just too much to move around safely and actually enjoy the expierience. Either way you cant go wrong with either the 45 or 46 I just personally lean toward the 45 for the reasons listed above. Find the best deal of whats available and you'll be happy with either. If you have any direct questions please feel free and I will do my best.

saltshaker
03-18-2013, 02:01 PM
All good points particularly regarding the improved layout of the later 45C II. I looked at the listing for Brava II the '89 in Coconut Grove. Wow she looks great. I'd put that on my short list of ones to look at. The bigger master and 2 head layout is a huge plus. I also like that there's a washer dryer on board. Looks like someone has spent some money updating and maintaining her. Look at the systems and you'll notice things like a head hunter water pump, Vacuflush heads, newer generator, Cablemaster, isolation transformer, upgraded windless, newer quality appliances, frameless windows, dripless shaft seals etc. Definitely worth a look.

jim rosenthal
03-18-2013, 03:59 PM
There is at least one Series II 45C for sale right now with Cummins M11s.... that to me is the preferred engine for this boat. There are also some with Cat 3196s, which I would probably avoid carefully. The later Cats (I think C12s?) are much better but I didn't see any with those.

I agree about how fast you can go with them- my Hatteras will do over thirty knots, which I've seen once or twice on sea trials etc. Most of the time I cruise at 22 knots, based on what the EGT and boost gauges tell me. Occasionally a bit faster. The advantage of the Cummins engines is that they are quieter, they use less fuel, they are easier to maintain because of the room around them, etc. That said, I would not throw out a set of DDs with useful life in them to make room for M11s. I never thought I would see Series II 45s as low-priced as they are, which means that you have to really think about repowering one.... you will really never get your money out of it except by keeping it for decades and having a great time with her.

Which, if you think about it, is what it's all about anyway.

Bugsy
03-18-2013, 04:29 PM
And now I'm compelled to ask; "What about the 43 C with 6V92's?" (of which I am an owner)

The OP spoke of the 45C and 46 and more recently reverted to a 41C and I'm wondering why the 43C was skipped.

A few friends have 46C and I can recognize the differences between their boats and mine but the 45C I was on seemed identical to mine with the exception of a slightly larger cockpit. I believe the one I was on was a 1985.

The 45C had 535 hp engines so was faster than mine but the layout was identical.

Hence my question. My boat is on the market; "universally" recognized as being in very good condition and properly priced for the market; and, I'd like to know if I'm being overlooked because of a perception that a 45C is a "better" boat.

By the way---is the 45C discussed above at Dinner Key or at Grove Harbour?

capttonyf
03-18-2013, 05:14 PM
Bugsy, You are correct the 43C is the same boat as the 45C up until they updated the layout in 1989. The only difference as mentioned above is the 45 has a 2ft Longer Cockpit which helped considerably from a fishing/Diving standpoint for obvious reasons, but from a cruising standpoint it also improved the handling by giving the boat a little more level running attitude without needing as much Trim tab, Increased the Speed all while adding an Additional 110 Gallons of fuel. The 43 runs a little Proud "nose High "compared to the 45, nothing extreme but you do notice it. Depending on how someone is going to use their boat the 43 is just fine and I would not turn anyone from a good deal on one in nice condition, after all it is a Hatteras and is a great cruising vessel it's just from a fishing perspective or a travelling cruiser the 45 would be a better option due to the larger cockpit and additional fuel. Hatteras did the excact same thing by adding 2 ft of cockpit to the early 1980's 50C and calling it a 52C. One last note on the 43C I sold one years ago for a guy in Islamorada that had a very rare Euro layout with a gally up a Huge forward master in the Bow, a bunk guest stateroom and a Bow entered Crew cabin forward of the master stateroom that wasnt much larger than the anchor locker.

jim rosenthal
03-18-2013, 05:29 PM
Crew's quarters in a 43 ft boat? Must have had short crewmembers....

I like the 43C. I think that he was looking at the later 45C-II with the diagonal master, maybe I didn't read carefully enough...

Bugsy
03-18-2013, 05:52 PM
Phew!! Thanks, guys. I feel better now.

And you're right, Jim. The OP did narrow his comments regarding the 45C.

worldsaway
03-21-2013, 10:10 PM
Capttonyf, Sounds like I have the same boat you do. What size props are you running?

Bertellini
03-22-2013, 09:59 AM
Jim, why would you avoid the CAT 3196s? There is a 1984 45C for sale in CT that was repowered with them and seems to be priced competitively.

rsmith
03-22-2013, 10:28 AM
I always shake my head at these threads where someone asks recomendations on certain boats. Everyone jumps in with what they like and their favorites. No one ever asks the guy what his mission profile is to base their comments on what one would best suit his use.

saltshaker
03-22-2013, 11:31 AM
I always shake my head at these threads where someone asks recomendations on certain boats. Everyone jumps in with what they like and their favorites. No one ever asks the guy what his mission profile is to base their comments on what one would best suit his use.
I Think he got pretty much what he asked for. The utility of all 3 boats is pretty much the same. The points made are pretty relevant and accurate. The OPer needs to make his own decision as to which will suit his needs best. His budget will drive a lot of that decision. He may have enough to buy a fair 46HP or a pristine 45C series I. Now at least he has some ideas on what each has to offer. For me it's all based on each individual boat, it's condition, equipment and options. I like the 46Hp a lot more than the 45C II. Given the choice between a tired 46HP that wasn't equipped to my liking and a refit 45C II that was turn key for me, I'd opt for the 45C. He may want a boat with a tower. If he finds a great 46HP that's a bargain without a tower that may not be right for him. No different than any other options. I have a friend looking for a 52MY. Some of the nicest and best priced ones are 2 staterooms. He needs 3 so for him the others are out. If I was in the market for one of them, I'd look hard at the one that was repowered with QSM11's but has 2 staterooms. He's aware of it but for him the 3rd stateroom is a must.

capttonyf
03-22-2013, 11:41 AM
To Worldsaway, we are running 4 Blade 30"X33", Not sure if they were ever tweaked by a previous owner or not. Do to the fact the boat runs as well as it does I've never tried to fix whats not broken and the told prop techs to just check balance and don't mess with them.

As far as rsmith shaking his head I kind of agree. You really do need to know someones intended use and tastes before recommending any type of boat, but he was pretty specific in what he is already considering. Most people replying only want to be helpful by expressing the differences between the two models along with their preference. If you look that is what I did, I mentioned that either boat would be great depending on whats IMPORTANT to him, which he did not state and why it may sway his decision one way or the other. I then explained why I went with the 45 over the 46. Either way as I mentioned before, find the best deal and go with it, you can't go wrong with either model.

capttonyf
03-22-2013, 11:47 AM
Well said, Jack.

Blaine Thorpe
03-22-2013, 02:36 PM
I always shake my head at these threads where someone asks recomendations on certain boats. Everyone jumps in with what they like and their favorites. No one ever asks the guy what his mission profile is to base their comments on what one would best suit his use.

I kind of disagree, maybe because I know what I want, and have been looking but haven't been able to get out there just having a new granddaughter, and two more grand babies coming soon. I am in the market for a 45-50 convertible. I have been on a 45, 46 and 50, but I appreciate hearing comments from those that have experience with each.

I will make my own decision based on the boats I find. Some will agree with my decision, other may not. In the end it my decision based on what's out there. I will take all of the input I can get.

Blaine

capttonyf
03-22-2013, 03:24 PM
I kind of disagree, maybe because I know what I want, and have been looking but haven't been able to get out there just having a new granddaughter, and two more grand babies coming soon. I am in the market for a 45-50 convertible. I have been on a 45, 46 and 50, but I appreciate hearing comments from those that have experience with each.

I will make my own decision based on the boats I find. Some will agree with my decision, other may not. In the end it my decision based on what's out there. I will take all of the input I can get.

Blaine

Blaine, where do you do most of your boating because that could play into factor on your decision. Of the 3 boats you mentioned the 50C needs nearly a 1ft. more water at 5 1/2 feet then the other boats you named. We boat in the Keys/Bahamas' alot and that extra draft can make a big difference if you frequent alot of the smaller marina's like Smugglers Cove, Holiday Isle, Dolphin Marina etc. Most tell you they have 6ft. but I know thats not the case, I think Holiday Isle lists a MLW of 4'6" if I remember correctly and I wrapped a Gaff around a wheel of a 54C while stirring sand at Smugglers Cove once. If looking for a 3rd stateroom and thats why you considering a 50C, maybe consider a 52C and it gets you back under 5 ft. with Keel protection. There was a nice 1995 50C available when I was looking but Draft and Fuel burn brought me back to the 45C and I couldn't be happier. When you do finally see the one for you,,,,you'll know it!

Blaine Thorpe
03-22-2013, 03:32 PM
Blaine, where do you do most of your boating because that could play into factor on your decision. Of the 3 boats you mentioned the 50C needs nearly a 1ft. more water at 5 1/2 feet then the other boats you named. We boat in the Keys/Bahamas' alot and that extra draft can make a big difference if you frequent alot of the smaller marina's like Smugglers Cove, Holiday Isle, Dolphin Marina etc. Most tell you they have 6ft. but I know thats not the case, I think Holiday Isle lists a MLW of 4'6" if I remember correctly and I wrapped a Gaff around a wheel of a 54C while stirring sand at Smugglers Cove once. If looking for a 3rd stateroom and thats why you considering a 50C, maybe consider a 52C and it gets you back under 5 ft. with Keel protection. There was a nice 1995 50C available when I was looking but Draft and Fuel burn brought me back to the 45C and I couldn't be happier. When you do finally see the one for you,,,,you'll know it!

For now, we are on the Illinois River 180 miles south of Lake Michigan, and draft is an issue. We also have a place in the Destin area, but we would bring it back to Illinois for now. I have found several we like, but there seems to be something about each one that stops us from buying it. We have a pretty good list of "like to haves" based on our 1100 mile trip from Peoria to Destin in our 36C.

Blaine

capttonyf
03-22-2013, 03:47 PM
For now, we are on the Illinois River 180 miles south of Lake Michigan, and draft is an issue. We also have a place in the Destin area, but we would bring it back to Illinois for now. I have found several we like, but there seems to be something about each one that stops us from buying it. We have a pretty good list of "like to haves" based on our 1100 mile trip from Peoria to Destin in our 36C.

Blaine

Like I've mentioned before I was a full time delivery captain for and a captain for Allied Marine when they sold Hatteras and I've run most of them with different Pwr pkgs and many othe brands as well. If you ever have any questions about performance and an honest Opinion I would be happy to help.

jim rosenthal
03-22-2013, 05:34 PM
Caterpillar 3196s were an update on a predecessor engine called the 3176. Both engines have a terrible reputation on reliability and that was when they were new- now that they are old, they have just as bad a rep and with all the additional problems of aging equipment. That was a bad era for Cat in marine engines- they also built the 3116 and 3126 at that time, two engines I personally suffered with (one set in my own Hatteras, one set in a friends identical boat) There was a period there when it seemed like anything Cat built in pleasure boat engines was good for headaches only. Except for the 3208, which was still around then, and that only up to 375 hp. Above that, bets were off.

Friends of mine who are yacht brokers report that boats with any of those two (3176 or 3196) are hard to sell; their reputation has affected their value and desirability. Friends of mine who are in the marine diesel business (Cat dealers and others) report that while not all units of the 3176 and 3196 families are bad engines, the failure rate and downtime are quite a bit higher than other competitors' engines. I wouldn't have them, and I would go to considerable trouble and expense to avoid owning or getting on a boat with them. I would never have a 3116 or 3126 again, and if I was a passenger on a boat equipped with them, I'd want towing insurance and a life raft in the bargain.

Caterpillar has built several very good diesels that were used in boats: the 343- 353 series, the 3208, 3406 and various versions of the 3412 as well. Some of the later Cats such as the C12 and C18, which I think may be versions of the 06 series, have a good name as well. But I think the word is out on the 16 and 76 series engines- they weren't sorted out before they went into production and were installed in boats and there were a lot of unhappy owners out there, plus a lot of devalued boats cursed with them.

As I said, not all of them were bad. But I'm in favor of buying a boat with engines that have a good reputation. If you're feeling lucky and sporty and want to take a chance with something other than that, have at it. You might do fine- or not, as the case might be.

rsmith
03-23-2013, 10:31 AM
I Think he got pretty much what he asked for. The utility of all 3 boats is pretty much the same. The points made are pretty relevant and accurate. The OPer needs to make his own decision as to which will suit his needs best. His budget will drive a lot of that decision. He may have enough to buy a fair 46HP or a pristine 45C series I. Now at least he has some ideas on what each has to offer. For me it's all based on each individual boat, it's condition, equipment and options. I like the 46Hp a lot more than the 45C II. Given the choice between a tired 46HP that wasn't equipped to my liking and a refit 45C II that was turn key for me, I'd opt for the 45C. He may want a boat with a tower. If he finds a great 46HP that's a bargain without a tower that may not be right for him. No different than any other options. I have a friend looking for a 52MY. Some of the nicest and best priced ones are 2 staterooms. He needs 3 so for him the others are out. If I was in the market for one of them, I'd look hard at the one that was repowered with QSM11's but has 2 staterooms. He's aware of it but for him the 3rd stateroom is a must.

Thats the problem since most on this forum dont fish the only difference to them is 1' and the accommodations. I've fished the 45 series 1&2 and the 46 gen 1 71 & 92 versions.
Weather Live baiting off the Fla east coast or overnight trips to the NE canyons or being competitive in tournaments each one of these boats have signifigant differences.

saltshaker
03-23-2013, 10:45 AM
Thats the problem since most on this forum dont fish the only difference to them is 1' and the accommodations. I've fished the 45 series 1&2 and the 46 gen 1 71 & 92 versions.
Weather Live baiting off the Fla east coast or overnight trips to the NE canyons or being competitive in tournaments each one of these boats have signifigant differences.
I don't fish but I don't think the difference between these boats is only 1ft and some accommodations. I thought I pointed out a few of those differences. However for the majority, including those that fish, interior and layout is important. Since you fish seriously and have experience on the boats in question, why not post what those differences are.

capttonyf
03-23-2013, 01:20 PM
I don't fish but I don't think the difference between these boats is only 1ft and some accommodations. I thought I pointed out a few of those differences. However for the majority, including those that fish, interior and layout is important. Since you fish seriously and have experience on the boats in question, why not post what those differences are.

I agree, if you have any opinions based on your expierience between these two boats on how they fish differently I would appriciate the input. I'm always looking to learn somthing based on someone elses time/expieriences on a particular vessel. I'm always willing to listen and try further my knowledge. Any insight toward fishability would be appriciated.

geofish
03-24-2013, 10:10 AM
Hello All,

My 1982 46 HPC is in drydock undergoing a somewhat major refit. I love the boat, the rooms and layout, I had a swimstep built but I am thinking should I install a "bait slammer" there instead?
A bait slammmer is like an extention of the hull but just from the bottom up to swim platform level, I wonder if the boat would run flatter with about 2.5 feet of bottom...

Spellbound
03-25-2013, 04:09 PM
I do fish alot (both Atlantic & Pacific) and like Saltshaker and Capttonyf...... I am very interested in the "significant differences" of these two models.

captddis
03-25-2013, 05:23 PM
I wrote a lengthy comparisin a couple years ago.
I have a 46HP 1983 with 650HP 8V92's. Like Tony I used to do new Hatteras delivery's and I make my living working on these boats .

Here are some differences:

Hatteras had both the 46 and 45C in the line up in 1984. The 46C had a base price of 100,000 dollars more than the 45c. The price alone pretty much killed the 46c.
The 46C has two full heads and enclosed showers, 45c has one head [excep the last year45]
46 had a 15kw gen 45 had a 8kw
46 has centerline keel tanks and easy access to everything under the cockpit. 45 has fuel tanks under the cockpit and accessing the mufflers is almost impossible
46 has three Ac units, 45 has two units and the staterooms share the same unit
46 has 2 1/2" shafts and huge rudders. 45 has 2" and much smaller rudders
46c has 24 volt starting circuit and three chargers, 45 has 12volt and one charger.
46c has Galley maid water pump 45 has little par pump
46 c has queen bed option, 45 had v berth and seperate beds.
46c had the Hynautic 42 series pump and turns on a dime, 45 had the H21 pump.
46C water heater in under the cockpit, 45c has it outboard of stbd engine
46c has 8v92's 45C has 6v92's

The engine room on the 46 is well laid out and you can crawl outboard of the engines. The 45 c has a very cramped engine room and you have to raise the hatches to service the AC units and even then it is a pain.

Both are good boats and both raise fish. Now both boats sell for the same price, why buy a 45?
For a repower candidate, why not get the boat with the big running gear already installed?

Two other things
The AC on the 46c is much better laid out, the salon air handler is under the bridge and cools evenly. The 45 c Air cond in the salon is at floor level in a cabibet and the discharge blows out and freezes people on the couch and leaves the rest of the salon hot. We did remedy that on my friends 45.
The 46 has a L shaped galley just down from the salon movement in and out is easy. The galley on the 45 is along the port side and creates a hall that causes a traffic jam getting by someone working in the galley when you want to use the head etc.

Lastly,
After I bought my 46 C[ after wanting that very boat for 20 years], My friend bought a 1985 45 C because he thought it would be more efficient. He has said a number of times that he wished he had bought a 46cHP.

saltshaker
03-25-2013, 06:29 PM
Excellent post Dave! I had a '74 46C and some of the comparisons Dave made apply to the 46C and the 46CHP. Without a doubt the 46HP is a much improved boat and a prime candidate for repower for the reasons stated by Dave.

Bertellini
03-25-2013, 06:33 PM
And now the next question: aside from age and the inevitable pitfalls it brings to boat ownership, what are the advantages/disadvantages to the 46C Series I versus Series II?

worldsaway
03-25-2013, 08:33 PM
A couple of clarifications regarding the 45C features. There are a couple of different features on the later model 45C that are different from the earlier models regarding layout and equipment. They do have a tapered walk around queen berth in the master and over/under berths in forward stateroom. The salon a/c handler is located in the salon overhead not in the cabinet on the floor. Mine has a galley maid pump for the freshwater pump not a small par pump. There are two heads although only one has a separate shower stall. As Dave said, outboard access to the engines and ac units is pretty tough.

I do think the increased performance of the 46HP is nice but have been quite happy with the 45.

captddis
03-25-2013, 08:53 PM
Yes the late 45C 89-91 models had a much different interior and much more modern.

My intention was to give the requested comparisin, not to pick on the 45C. It is still all Hatteras and is solid as a rock.

capttonyf
03-26-2013, 10:02 AM
And now the next question: aside from age and the inevitable pitfalls it brings to boat ownership, what are the advantages/disadvantages to the 46C Series I versus Series II?

The series II is essentially the same boat with reworked stringers, more power and heavier running gear. If you meant the series III from the mid 90's that is a completly different boat. More Modern Styling, New hull design, Heavier, Thirstier and a higher cockpit freeboard. I feel its a nice solid boat but for some reason never really had great popularity. My only assumption was draft, MPG, and cockpit could have been a little roomier. Had nice Cockpit Engine Room access and alot of BIG boat features and systems. Maybe price/performance compared to what was available from Bertram and Viking at the time. Not quite sure, but with 735HP DD8V92's burning 65 GPH +/- boat could have been faster. The 50C with 1271's of that era had very similer MPG and a 3rd Stateroom. Again this is just an assumption maybe someone else can shed some light on this. In reference to CAPTDDIS/WORLDSAWAY both were accurate in there comments about 45's/46's but alot depends on years and options. For example my 1990 45C has a water heater under cockpit just forward of fighting chair post were a Live well was optional. Lastly keep in mind with boats of this age when talkng about Pumps, chargers, electrical systems etc. Many of these things will have been updated and parts swapped out or updated so you really don't know what you will have until you look into a particular vessel. But like I, CAPTDDIS and others have mentioned you cant go wrong with either model, its all a matter of preference and what happens to be the best deal at the time your shopping. I could have lived with either but I personally prefered the master layout in Newer 45C and more importantly the Longer, Larger, Roomier cockpit, The 45C has about a foot or two extra space between the fighting chair and the tackle center which was important to me. We fun fish as a family always numerous friends and KIDS. And if anyone else here know KIDS they always want to be right in the middle of the action which means hanging of the chair like its a jungle gym. But hey Its all for the kids right? There is a awsome looking/refit/repowered Custom 46C in Key West, FL. available. Its expensive but compared to what else is on the market but compared to what it must have cost to due the Refit, I'm guessing between $750K to $1mill. Its a bargin. Looks like a custom boat with a reworked salon window and a Yellow hull,,, Very sharp.

Bertellini
05-07-2013, 11:59 PM
Through this thread and a lot of additional research, I have been looking in to scenarios of repowering one of these boats (probably a 46HP or a 45CII). I have seen it mentioned that modern diesels, for the sake of argument QSM11s or C12s, weigh significantly less than the DDs that originally came in these boats and as such can lessen the ride. That said, the spec sheets show that each engine is only about 700 lbs lighter than its DD counterpart. What is the difference in weight of the updated transmissions?

My question is, am I giving this too much thought given the noise reduction, reduced fuel burn, and significant increase in speed that these engines will provide? Would adding a small Whaler tender or a tower counteract any ride deficiencies? Keep in mind that the cost of such a project and logistical issues like shaft size, engine room renovations, new props, etc are obviously a factor, but I am working on a plan for building the boat that I want.

saltshaker
05-08-2013, 12:09 AM
Don't remember the exact numbers but when I looked into putting QSM11's in my 46C the weight savings was about 3K lbs. I wouldn't worry too much about it and if you want to repower one, a 46C HP would be an ideal candidate since they already have the larger running gear and the hull can handle the speed. IMHO the QSM11 is by far the best choice for this hull. Cat C15s or C18s will fit and she would be extremely fast but be prepared to spend some serious cash. If your dead set on doing the repower, look for a good boat with high hour or blown engines unless you want to do a total refit.

jim rosenthal
05-08-2013, 06:32 AM
Several of these boats have been repowered with M11s- they are very fast, use far less fuel, and ride and handle fine according to their owners. Also, M11s are available through the Cummins recon program for far less than new Cats or anything else, in ratings up to 660hp, which is plenty. They are by far the best deal out there. Also the service access is better as they are narrower than V engines and can be set up with most of the routine service points inboard. 32-34 knots WOT would be in line with previous repowers.

As far as the ride goes, you're talking about a boat that weighs at least forty thousand pounds. Does making it three thousand pounds lighter really affect the ride that much? I wonder. I would think it would not.

hatteras 1985
05-09-2013, 01:34 AM
What is the difference between the hull of the 55C Series I (1979-1988) and the hull of the 54C Series I (1991-1997)?

saltshaker
05-09-2013, 08:39 AM
Completely different hulls. The 54C I was a new hull design for Hatteras. It later became the 55C II and then the 60C II. Same hull up until a '10? when Hatteras retooled the hull for the 60GT.

hatteras 1985
05-12-2013, 09:00 PM
Completely different hulls. The 54C I was a new hull design for Hatteras. It later became the 55C II and then the 60C II. Same hull up until a '10? when Hatteras retooled the hull for the 60GT.


I was on a late 2000s 54C at one of the Miami boat shows and the interior feels much, much smaller than the 1990s 54C.

saltshaker
05-12-2013, 11:44 PM
The layout of the 54C I and the 54C II is very similar. I think the 54C is a bit smaller due to the shallower draft. The ER is smaller and I think some cabin space was taken up in making the ER big enough to handle V12 Cats. Salon seems about the same but the starboard stateroom is smaller and they needed to steal some space under the stairs and dinette to get 2 berths in there. That also required moving the washer dryer to the forward stateroom. Master is a little tighter and again they had to slide it a bit under the galley to keep it from shrinking too much. Both heads are smaller and I don't think there was an option for the third head like in the 54C I.

Albert Jr.
06-15-2013, 01:13 PM
:eek::eek:

I just started a thread for the same exact reason. (I'm new here)

Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us.

I was looking at a few of the 46 series 1 and 2 but I've noticed that none of the have tuna towers.

Is there a reason for this ?

Also, I didn't completely understand the last answer...
Which is better, the 46 series 1 or 46 series 2 ? (I'm asking because I read that the series 2 had a shorter keel)

And if you say 46hp, are you referring to the 46 series 2 ?

Avenger
06-15-2013, 05:45 PM
Towers are aftermarket or dealer installed so they don't show up in the brochures.

Albert Jr.
06-15-2013, 05:54 PM
Towers are aftermarket or dealer installed so they don't show up in the brochures.

Alright and what about the 46 series 1 v.s. series 2...
Which is better ?

And what do people mean with the 46 HP ?

Avenger
06-15-2013, 07:21 PM
HP means High Performance. It was a higher horsepower version with a cut-down keel to prevent keel-walking.

There should be some discussion in the other thread you found.

Boatsb
06-15-2013, 08:44 PM
HP means High Performance. It was a higher horsepower version with a cut-down keel to prevent keel-walking.

There should be some discussion in the other thread you found.

If I remember the er is different and the stateroom smaller too

Albert Jr.
06-15-2013, 08:44 PM
HP means High Performance. It was a higher horsepower version with a cut-down keel to prevent keel-walking.

There should be some discussion in the other thread you found.

Uhm I started the other thread but only got one answer... to find and subscribe to this thread.

I also asked the question on another website and they suspect that
because there weren't many series 2 build that the series 1 was better.

Btw this might sound amateurish but what is keel walking ?
(I assume that it's when the boat only rides on the keel)

What is the problem with when the boat starts keel walking ?

Albert Jr.
06-15-2013, 09:16 PM
If I remember the er is different and the stateroom smaller too

What is an ER ?
Sorry for the simple questions guys but I'm still someone who hasn't owned a yacht or newer cc yet.

The only yacht I've really been on 'once' is an old Hatt 45 from 1969

dsharp
06-15-2013, 09:56 PM
Er= engine room. Not sure what keel walking is. Heard a lot about it on the web but never ran a Hat that did it. I don't know how fast you have to go to cause it but I would guess it would take a major increase in horse power.

captddis
06-15-2013, 10:35 PM
Uhm I started the other thread but only got one answer... to find and subscribe to this thread.

I also asked the question on another website and they suspect that
because there weren't many series 2 build that the series 1 was better.

Btw this might sound amateurish but what is keel walking ?
(I assume that it's when the boat only rides on the keel)

What is the problem with when the boat starts keel walking ?

The blowhards on YF don't know what theyu are talking about.
The seriesII 46 C HP was an entirely different boat from the 46C series 1. Same basic hull but that is it. The reason that they were only built for 2 years is because the 45C came out in 1984 and the 46cHP had a base price of 100,000 more than the 45C.
Again if you search a little the info is here. Don't mean to be rude, but I type very slow and don't want to retype it.

Keel walking is when the speed increases enough that the boat starts to use the keel like a ski. Most older Hatts would start to experience the keel walking around 27 kts. The 46HP had the keel modified at the factory and it was not an issue.

captddis
06-16-2013, 03:53 PM
Albert,
I saw your post on YF. the nomenclature is 46C HP is a 46 convertable, High Performance model which is a series two.

If you have not already, look at the brochure archives on this site. You can compare the models side by side. Here is a pic of my 46HP.

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t213/Herculesrhapsody/P1000615.jpg (http://s161.photobucket.com/user/Herculesrhapsody/media/P1000615.jpg.html)

Albert Jr.
06-16-2013, 04:32 PM
Albert,
I saw your post on YF. the nomenclature is 46C HP is a 46 convertable, High Performance model which is a series two.

If you have not already, look at the brochure archives on this site. You can compare the models side by side. Here is a pic of my 46HP.

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t213/Herculesrhapsody/P1000615.jpg (http://s161.photobucket.com/user/Herculesrhapsody/media/P1000615.jpg.html)

Thats a nice Hatt you have there.
I've seen both now and I'm beginning to understand the differences.
(primarily being the color difference)

Thanks a lot for the help. :)

Albert Jr.
06-17-2013, 11:57 AM
Btw, which dimensions is the cockpit space of a Hatt 46 HP ?
Also, which dimensions is the cockpit space of a Viking 46 of similar year ?

GJH
06-17-2013, 12:36 PM
If you want a lot of bad advice, speculation and third hand myths about these boats, Yacht Forums is the place to go. Here at HOF, you get actual owners, and subject matter experts like Dave (captddis).

Bertellini
08-24-2013, 11:19 AM
Since starting this thread, I have continued some pretty thorough research on what has been recommended to be be the best of these two models, the 46HP and the '89-92 45CII. I have a few more questions for those that have owned and/or spent time on these boats: which is the better sea boat, and how does each handle in specific conditions, i.e. drifting, following sea, head sea, trolling? I am planning for a long term relationship with whichever of these girls I choose, so in terms of a repower, which model is better suited for higher speeds? Some have asserted that neither handle that well over 26-27kts, despite meticulous attention to repower details, lifting strikes, etc. Also, the minimal length and beam increases aside, the 46 seems to need a good bit more power to achieve equivalent speeds. Would this be attributed to the older hull design? Deeper keel? Larger running gear? All the above? Finally, which is more of a wet boat? I have read comments that the 46 has a tendancy to sneeze up on the bridge, is this because of the more old school bow entry?

captddis
08-24-2013, 12:44 PM
As far as being wet, All the Hatts of the period can be wet. However I have a 46C and my friend has a 45C. When we travel together his boat will have salt on the bridge and I won't.
As far as speed to compare apples to apples, I did a lot of work on a 46C repowered with 6V92 TA that topped out at 26kts. My friend with the 45C had fresh 6V92TA and tops out at 23 kts.
The 6V92 in the 46 were DDEC 565 HP and the 6V92TA in the 45 are 535HP.

jim rosenthal
08-24-2013, 09:50 PM
We have one forum member, Captain Coop, who owns a Series II 45C which was re-powered with M11 Cummins engines by Jarrett Bay several years ago. This is when the maximum hp rating on that engine was about 660 hp, if I recall right. That engine is now rated above 700 hp, I believe.

Capt Coop's boat, Green Eyed Girl, did 34 knots on her sea trials, in salt water, with the engine load readouts showing about 93-94% at WOT- in other words, they could still accommodate a bit more propeller pitch. From what they reported to me, the boat handled that speed admirably, running at a stable attitude with no keel or chine walking.

From what owners have told me, and folks who restore these boats for a living and have done both, there is probably more speed in the Series II 45C hull than there is in the late 46C. But how often do you use WOT and all the speed your boat has to give you? Hardly ever; once a season or less.

I think you would be happy with either; I think spending some time on both models will give you an idea which boat offers the accommodations you want, and with which you will be most happy. And since all of them are used now, and all have some age on them, some of your decision may be made for you in the sense that you will want the best example of whatever boat you pick that you can afford. Given that it's pretty much a buyers' market, it makes sense to hold out for the best boat you can possibly find.

Good luck in the search- they are both fine boats and I hope you find the right one for you and have many happy years of boating with her. A good Hatteras becomes a member of the family. Ask me how I know.

rsmith
08-25-2013, 02:01 PM
I ran into Ray Meyers when the 45 gen 2 came out. Hatt had one fishing the Cape May county tournament. They were docked behind us. I can't remember but I think it was a "Laurie " and not a "Hatterascal" Hatt used both names for their co. Boats. If you don't know Ray he was at Hatt from the start. I met him at High Point when my dad bought our 34 in '65. it was a typical sloppy NE offshore tournament and after the first day I asked him what he thought of the "new "45 all he would say was it was not what the old 45 was. I have tons of trips on 46's (gen 1) but never ran a 45 (2) until the mid 90's in a Palm Beach sailfish tournament. Fla live bait sail fishing is not NE canyon running but I found the 45 to be more of the "new" boat lighter feel. It's hard to describe but the older Hatt ride was more plowing thru the seas where the newer feel is more of an "on top" feel. I run and fished on the 42,46and 55 oceans and while its not the "flexible flyer" kind of ride for offshore canyon fishing I'd prefer to be on the old 46.
Anyone looking at a boat as a fishing platform really needs to run one in the conditions they expect to use it.
Some things you might think are great ideas at the dock but offshore not so good. A friend of mine bought one of the first 8/92 46's. Most had what they called the "European " layout with the queen berth owners stateroom forward. Jim was probably pushing 300 lbs at the time and he raved about how great it was to have the big berth and how much quieter it was not sleeping with your head against the ER bulkhead. He also liked to sleep for the 4 hour run offshore. One of the first trips the boat launched off a wave Jim flew off the berth laid his head open and got all banged up.
Like I said ,until you run one in the conditions you intend to use it you really don't know.

capttonyf
08-26-2013, 02:10 PM
You can't go wrong with either boat. I have a 1990 45C and we love it. As I stated before in this post and just as recent as last week on another post with someone considering purchasing a 45 where I explained all the boats performance #'s, they're both great boats with a little give and take of pros and cons it's hard to fault either one. I personally like the walk around midship queen and Longer, larger cockpit of the 45 but also would not steer away from the 46 for the right deal. I looked at both the 45 and 46, Its just when purching ours this was the cleanest best available boat for the money and I'm happy, BUT would have been equally happy with the 46. I have pictures posted on this site of our boat "After Hours" out of the water when the bottom was painted and if you take a look it will give you a good idea of what the Keel looks like and you will see when comparing with the 46 its smaller, but similar to the keel on the 46HP. If you have any direct questions about the our 1990 45C I'll be happy to help any way I can. I ran hundreds of boats and really believe in the Hatteras product. We always recieve compliments from friends of other boat brands when they're out with us on how solid the boat feels and how impressed they are with the ride. As a matter of fact our one friends that owns a Mid 90's MAN Powered Viking 47C was seriously trying to get us to trade with him, he said he loved the ride of ours and didn't care about the speed of the 47 that much anymore. I have not been on his 47 in bad weather but for him to even propose this it must be substantial. Not sure just how serious he was, but he said it and I kind of laughed it off. We really do love our little Hatteras.

Kirk Rogers
08-28-2013, 05:43 PM
Can it be assumed that all 46c's of model year 1984 were HP's? Was it an option? If it has 650hp
8V92's, would that constitute an HP version?

Thanks,
Kirk

captddis
08-28-2013, 05:59 PM
Can it be assumed that all 46c's of model year 1984 were HP's? Was it an option? If it has 650hp
8V92's, would that constitute an HP version?

Thanks,
Kirk

No. The 46C could still be ordered with 8V71TI during the 82 to 84 years.

Kirk Rogers
08-28-2013, 06:23 PM
So, I guess my question is: If it is a 1984 46c with 8V92 650's, is it reasonable that it would be an HP version? Would the serial number indicate such?

Thanks,
Kirk

captddis
08-28-2013, 06:26 PM
So, I guess my question is: If it is a 1984 46c with 8V92 650's, is it reasonable that it would be an HP version? Would the serial number indicate such?

Thanks,
Kirk



Correct. All 8v92 46 were HP models from 82 to 84. Even the 8v71 models got the same HP hull and running gear. Used to be that the double stripe denoted it as a HP model.

Kirk Rogers
08-28-2013, 06:29 PM
Correct. All 8v92 46 were HP models from 82 to 84. Even the 8v71 models got the same HP hull and running gear. Used to be that the double stripe denoted it as a HP model.


Thank you,

Kirk

maxbad
09-01-2013, 08:49 PM
Hey I am looking at buying either a 45C series II or 46 hp and I wonder how does the 46 series II ride in a following sea compared to a 45 series II. The reason i ask this is because down here in trinidad there is a 46 II with 892's that has a bad rep for how it handles a big quarter following sea. there is a story about a time the boat broached so badly that it almost flung the captain out of the bridge (note this boat has a full tuna tower) down here my cruising routes normally involve a return trip which is normally 60 miles of following seas dead off the stern. the other route has a return with 80 miles of quartering following seas. As you can see the way a boat handles a following sea is a major concern for me when looking.

thanks in advance

GMax

rsmith
09-01-2013, 10:36 PM
I've heard this also about boats that have had the keels cut. I've run both versions of the 46 and never saw this problem. Cutting the keel is a big deal with the guys that want to go fast but there is no free lunch and by changing one thing something else is going to suffer. Hats always did well in following seas mostly because of the large keel they have historically used.