Delammination

[LENZ]

Check this out.

http://www.rotdoctor.com/glass/GLrotrepair.html

passages, Thanks great site!!!!

[Starman]

Saw dust.......????

I read that article and quite frankly saw dust in my opinion is one of the worst items you can use as a filler to repair any rot.

Lenz,

If I understand correctly, this delamination is under or near the helm seat ? If so, you can drill a couple holes in that area and force some air in to blow out any existing moisture. This may also be done with a shop vac by sucking out moisture and debris.

Use West System epoxy with the 404 filler. You can buy empty caulk tubes as well. Mix the epoxy with the hardner really well, then add the 404 until you have a mixture thicker than pancake batter, but still a bit smooth.

Use a paint stick and fill the empty caulk cartridge, and then using the cartridge with a caulk gun, pump the void until you see some of this resin mixture comming out of the secondary hole(s) you drilled.

This should buy you some time, but it only is a temp patch because you need to find the source of the leak, and if near the helm seat, it is probably time to recaulk those thru-bolts.

If the whole area near/under the helm seat is bad, do as directed earlier and use a skill saw with about 1/4 to 3/8 depth and cut out the top layer of glass.

Dig out the mush and dry very well.

Gring the edges of this cut out back about 3 inches and at an angle ( so you thin out the good glass near the hole.

For areas like this where helm seats are being mounted, I use marine grade ply as the filler instead of balsa. Cut the ply usually about 3/4 , to fit the hole. Use west with 406 additive and again mix to a paste . Goop this paste through out the open area and squish in the plywood. Set something ( a brick or two ) with some weight to hoold it down while the epoxy cures.

The next day, sand or grind smooth the epoxy. Fill any obvious voids with the paste again , and at the same time, begin layering the patch with fiberglass using the west epoxy.

Cut your fiberglass cloth ( preferably 1808 ) This is a biaxial glass with a matt backing to fit the entire cut out and lap over the areas that were grinded. Cut a smaller piece to fit on top of the first and so on . Shoud have about 4-5 layers.

Next, after drying, sand smooth. Fill any small dips with west sytem epoxy and the 410 mixture. This is for faring, and sand easily.

Hope this helps you decide what to do.

[LENZ]

Saw dust.......????

I read that article and quite frankly saw dust in my opinion is one of the worst items you can use as a filler to repair any rot.

Lenz,

If I understand correctly, this delamination is under or near the helm seat ? If so, you can drill a couple holes in that area and force some air in to blow out any existing moisture. This may also be done with a shop vac by sucking out moisture and debris.

Use West System epoxy with the 404 filler. You can buy empty caulk tubes as well. Mix the epoxy with the hardner really well, then add the 404 until you have a mixture thicker than pancake batter, but still a bit smooth.

Use a paint stick and fill the empty caulk cartridge, and then using the cartridge with a caulk gun, pump the void until you see some of this resin mixture comming out of the secondary hole(s) you drilled.

This should buy you some time, but it only is a temp patch because you need to find the source of the leak, and if near the helm seat, it is probably time to recaulk those thru-bolts.

If the whole area near/under the helm seat is bad, do as directed earlier and use a skill saw with about 1/4 to 3/8 depth and cut out the top layer of glass.

Dig out the mush and dry very well.

Gring the edges of this cut out back about 3 inches and at an angle ( so you thin out the good glass near the hole.

For areas like this where helm seats are being mounted, I use marine grade ply as the filler instead of balsa. Cut the ply usually about 3/4 , to fit the hole. Use west with 406 additive and again mix to a paste . Goop this paste through out the open area and squish in the plywood. Set something ( a brick or two ) with some weight to hoold it down while the epoxy cures.

The next day, sand or grind smooth the epoxy. Fill any obvious voids with the paste again , and at the same time, begin layering the patch with fiberglass using the west epoxy.

Cut your fiberglass cloth ( preferably 1808 ) This is a biaxial glass with a matt backing to fit the entire cut out and lap over the areas that were grinded. Cut a smaller piece to fit on top of the first and so on . Shoud have about 4-5 layers.

Next, after drying, sand smooth. Fill any small dips with west sytem epoxy and the 410 mixture. This is for faring, and sand easily.

Hope this helps you decide what to do.

Thanks! I have learned alot from this thread.

[Starman]

We all learn every day


If you have any more questions I will be glad to try and answer them, as will every one else here.

[rtrafford]

ahh, the sole...replacing the balsa would then be rather simple, but if it failed once i'd be awfully tempted to go ahead and fill it with an epoxy filler instead of messing with the core. you'll never be back into that spot again, and if the rot was caused by the helm seat attachment you're better off with a solid core under it.

good advice about drying well, and don't forget to grind the glass under the old core well. acetone will help dry it out if it's still moist.

[jim rosenthal]

If you need a preformed piece of goods to put in there, I have had good luck with Coosa material as well. Stuff works great, can't get wet, and takes paint and epoxy very well. Also very strong, as much of their products have fiberglass layers in them.

[Banshee36]

For a temporary patch you could drill some hole and tap in a few grease fittings. then use a very very inxpensive greasegun and inject the thickend epoxy into the area. Due leave a vent hole so the extra expoxy has some where to go.
just a qiuck and dirty patching system. You really should fix it the right way though.
JW

[TedZ]

IMHO all of these very structural repairs do not take into account that there is no adhesion from the repair to the balsa. An inch edge to edge "connection" does not insure that there is a transfer of the load, in this case a rocking helm chair, to the existing structure. It will crack around the repair - all there is is skin and balsa - in short order.

Very difficult to make the new repair and the old balsa as an integral structure and indestructable epoxying to the skin doesn't help.

Ted

[GaryNW]

Replacement core, be it balsa or a substitute, definitely needs to be bonded well to the original core as well as the skins. West system's $3 booklet covers the subject pretty well. Basically they say bond the core with an epoxy/406 filler mix thickened to the consistancy of mayonnaise.
Gary

[Paul45c]

IMHO all of these very structural repairs do not take into account that there is no adhesion from the repair to the balsa. An inch edge to edge "connection" does not insure that there is a transfer of the load, in this case a rocking helm chair, to the existing structure. It will crack around the repair - all there is is skin and balsa - in short order.

Very difficult to make the new repair and the old balsa as an integral structure and indestructable epoxying to the skin doesn't help.

Ted

Do you think it would do the trick to use a couple of layers of glass cloth or tape from the old core edge to the new core patch replacement before putting the top skin back down on it? Seems like that would structurally bind it, no?