AC electrical problem getting crazy!!

[luckydave215]

In life there are risk takers and non risk takers.
I'm a risk taker. I raced motorcycles for 20+ years, I race cars still, I fly aerobatics. Oh, and I'm an engineer.
Even a risk taker like me thinks troubleshooting live ac circuits is idiotic and can get you killed.

[Genesis]

There are non-contact electrical probes for AC systems - go get one at Home Depot. It's a plastic pen-like thing that you turn on and then place close to (but not touching) the wire you think might be energized - if it is, it beeps.

With that you can trace the presence (or absence) of AC voltage without having to make contact with anything that is actually live. Nonetheless, if you're not comfortable working around line-power circuits call someone who is - you can be killed probing a live AC system, and it's easy to make a mistake. This is especially true on a boat where becoming inadvertently grounded (that's how you get killed most of the time when it happens) is quite easy.

[krush]

Neutral is not going to kill you especially since it's often bonded to ground anyway so touching the neutral is pretty much like touching the metal case of the fridge.

And if the neutral wire somehow got disconnected in the panel box or cut on somewhere along the way, it is easily possibly to have a neutral wire that is energized like the hot.

PS: Touching the metal case on a fridge can zap you under certain circumstances too. Bad things happen.

[REBEL]

Tic Tracers were outlawed in the electrical industry years ago. They are a "cheater" to see if a circuit is alive or not. Once the circuit is off, it needs to be verified by a trusted meter, and if its hot enough, checked with a second known meter. I wouldnt stake my life against a meter thats made in Japan. Even if the line is off, we work between two grounds with a hot stick hooked on as a backup warning. The hot stick has to be verified at the beginning of every shift as well, with a second known good hotstick.
I had a co-worker lose a hand from a pinhole in his leather covered rubber linemans gloves. Electricity knows no quiting time. Rebel

[J's Dream]

There are non-contact electrical probes for AC systems - go get one at Home Depot. It's a plastic pen-like thing that you turn on and then place close to (but not touching) the wire you think might be energized - if it is, it beeps.

Karl,

That tool is nick-named a "widow-maker" in the industry. For someone with little knowledge or understanding, this tool can and will get someone killed. Best advice is to call a qualified electrician.

Jason

[krush]

Karl,

That tool is nick-named a "widow-maker" in the industry. For someone with little knowledge or understanding, this tool can and will get someone killed. Best advice is to call a qualified electrician.

Jason

For educational sake, why are they called widow-makers? Is this on high voltage stuff or low voltage?

[Pascal]

Since every single electrical question is answered by "get a qualified electrician" maybe we should just ban electrical question

Yes I know that you can get zapped by neutral but using a wire with an insulated terminal is safe and sonis connecting the other side of that wire to the neutral bus when power is off.

You can then us a meter to and it's insultaed probes to test for power.

Oh yeah make sure your hands are dry, that you are wearing shoes, avoid doing this while sitting on an engine, and don't do it while intoxicated, high, or under the influence of medication

[J's Dream]

For educational sake, why are they called widow-makers? Is this on high voltage stuff or low voltage?

AC, 110 and up. They are notorious for not lighting up on a hot wire...giving people false confidence that the wire is not hot. If you have one of these tools, it can be used to verify power, but should be followed up with a good quality multimeter.

As for you, Pascal...if a question is presented like this, it indicates to me that the original poster is not familiar with troubleshooting electricity. So, yes...HIRE A QUALIFIED ELECTRICIAN. Are you willing to say to him..."eh, go ahead, nothing will happen...you won't get hurt."? I'm not going to tell him that.

[saltshaker]

Since every single electrical question is answered by "get a qualified electrician" maybe we should just ban electrical question

Yes I know that you can get zapped by neutral but using a wire with an insulated terminal is safe and sonis connecting the other side of that wire to the neutral bus when power is off.

You can then us a meter to and it's insultaed probes to test for power.

Oh yeah make sure your hands are dry, that you are wearing shoes, avoid doing this while sitting on an engine, and don't do it while intoxicated, high, or under the influence of medication

You forgot swimming or in the bath tub. I think the main concern here is most systems on our boats can be fixed by a DIY'er that has never worked on one of these. Electrical systems are different as mistakes can kill you and/or others. As I stated earlier, if someone is asking a basic electrical question, chances are they are not capable or qualified to do more involved or potentially dangerous work. I know a bit about medicine but don't think I should attempt brain surgery on myself. Putting on a Band-aid is fine but the heavy lifting should be done by a pro.

[fissioneng]

AC, 110 and up. They are notorious for not lighting up on a hot wire...giving people false confidence that the wire is not hot. If you have one of these tools, it can be used to verify power, but should be followed up with a good quality multimeter.

Great advice. I use one all the time to check if I have the correct breaker turned off by checking before and after. Then I check with the meter to make sure it's really dead. I never touch anything based solely on the result of the NCV detector.