Who has NEW self-contained AC onboard?

[Angela]

If it were mine, I wouldn't want to try to house and plumb all of the new self-contained units. I'd stick with something that can make use of the old air handlers(or at least their cabinetry).

I like the sound of going with a chiller unit and zoning each room in. You may be able to use the old piping but I'm not sure about size. If not, at least you could follow the same runs and find fan units to fit in the old spaces.

Trying to make use of the old air handlers is exactly what has brought me to this point. At first, the CruisAir dealer tried to do that by putting in the modulating unit that they currently manufacture. It never worked right and after struggling with trying to make that work for over a year, the guys in the higher ranks at CruisAir finally stepped in and told the dealer that the stuff they currently make will never work in my system and that they have to go back and re-manufacture the one they made 30 years ago and install that (which is what we ultimately had to do) - OR - I'd have to replace the entire system - condensing unit, air handlers, valves, thermostats, and all of the modulating electrical components that communicate between the thermostats/air handlers and the condensing unit. So, they had to remove that new one that they had installed, and build another one like the one they made 30 years ago, and install that one. It, too, has been nothing but problems. It leaks R-22 at connections/fittings on the condensing unit and I can't keep gas in it; I've had to replace the coil on the solenoid valve, etc.

I can't use the current air handlers with anything except the CruisAir condensing unit and design I already have (which is why replacement components are a special order, manfactured upon request kind of $$$$ item). This is why to replace the system with another one like it is well over $20,000, and CruisAir won't stand behind their product. Ain't no way I'm investing that kind of money for the 20-month failure when it comes.

The self-contained units will fit in the areas/cabinetry where the current air handlers are. I have more through hulls on this boat than I currently need since I started replacing my heads with Vacuflush and got rid of the overboard discharge hoses. That's 8 that, when I finish alll the Vacuflush installation, I'll have left over that will be capped off and eventually removed if I don't use them for something else. So, I wouldn't be adding any any more holes in the boat - just using what's already here. And, I could use my big pump to feed the two aft staterooms and the two remaining condensing units in the engine room that go to the other systems (pilothouse and galley/salon) on the boat. I'd install a smaller pump to run to the two forward staterooms, though. In short, the self-contained units are more simple to get in and working than is replacing my system with another one like it.

With a chiller, I cannot use the existing gas pipe. The insulated water pipes are much larger and those will have to be run starting from scratch - they're not going to fit in the same path as the gas pipes

Nothing going to be easy, but self contained units are the easiest to get in here than any other new remote system which is why I'm considering them IF I can confirm that the sound is an acceptable level, i.e. no louder than my already noisy air handlers.

Sure, I can patch up the condensing unit for now, and that's what I'll have to do (it's HOT here), but where will it spring a leak next week?

[SeaEric]

I have a one year old CruisAir self contained unit on my 31 Chris. Its pretty quiet. I leave it run all the time, either in full cool mode or the HU mode. No problems so far, but it was not cheap. It was a ground up install as the boat had no previous Air system at all.

[GJH]

I say this having no idea what the cost would be, but it sounds to me like your best option is to convert to the type of system that almost all of the rest of us have. While I have been happy with our CruisAir systems, you could always switch to MarineAirrr by Dometic for that purpose.

[SKYCHENEY]

I'm sure you already knew what I was going to say. I like sticking with the original equipment. But, if you can make the self contained units fit in without too much modification to cabinetry, I can see why you're considering that. I still don't like having sea water running all over the boat, though. A leak in the ER is one thing, but salt water puddling in your carpeting is another.

Right now it sounds like everything works fine except that you have freon leaks. Is that related to valves or just bad solder joints somewhere. If it's not a valve problem, it should be a simple fix. Maybe you shouldn't give up on it yet.

And remember, any thru-hull that is connected to a pick-up for the new units will probably need a scoop if you plan to use it while underway. That may be able to be done in the water, but otherwise you'd have to wait until the next haulout.

[yachtsmanbill]

I really like Angelas idea. I have a ton of old stuff to pull out and plenty of unused galleymade head ports and thru hulls..A smaller circ pump in situ by each unit seems simple, plus the in-out THs wont leave cooling water slime down the side of the boat. My stuff is sooo ratty and the new smaller units are each 110vac, whats the problem. Seems like a no brainer for a total refit, plus I can do one unit at a time. Hmmm ws

[Pascal]

i think a chiller system is an overkill and way too expensive for a 58 footer. usually you don't start seeing chillers until you get into the 75/80' range.

i still think your best option is to install remote condensing units like almost every other old hatt. has.

you will be able to reuse your existing copper tubing for gas, and water pump. no need to go reuse odl thruhulls and stuff seacocks and strainers and pumps all over the boat!

you shoudl be able to reuse your air handlers. they are usually sized for the room they're in. I understand your main compressor is different, as well as the valves and controls but the air handlers should be standard.

you may want to check with Ocean Breeze. they have many options: self contained, remote and chillers, and they do a lot special stuff. it's a small company, i called them a couple of times for my remote condensing units, talk to the owner/engineer, who seemed to know what's he's doing.

if you resolve the air handler issues, then it's "just" a matter of finding room in the ER to hang more condensing units.

there is a reason why all hatts and almost all MYs in that size range use remote compressors. it works. when one fails, you dont' loose everything and can jsut replace the compressor or air handler one by one as needed.

all in ones belong on small boats, not ours.

[mobilemn1]

Have you considered the self contained units that do not require water circulation. I know your boat is a lot bigger and you guys with the bigger boats have some fairly complicated systems. They make the self contained units that do not require water pumps or piping that are quiet and easily installed. And for seperate staterooms as you say you are planning you can go from 6000 BTU to 12000BTU depending on room size. Just a thought and not so expensive

[whaler23]

Here's another site with prices on chillers and self contained systems.

http://www.flagshipmarine.com/chiller.html

Seems like a 60K BTU chiller runs around 6K then you have to add the fan units and heat but pricing looks similar to several smaller split systems.

[Trojan]

Does the system work when you have freon in it? Or is your problem leaks? Or is the problem the main unit? My unit and system is 36 years years old and running fine. The only problem I have had was with freon leaks. I added a leak stop to my unit and so far I have not had to add any freon.
It just keeps on running. Just a thought before you spend all that money.
I also changed my repair person.
Bill

[krush]

If your problem is just leaks, fix it! Leaks are usually not too hard to fix once you find them.

I'd also seriously consider what pascal said and use existing evap/lines and put in multiple compressors and condensers in the engine room.

Try calling flagship and see if they can help you out.