going off the electric grid....

[nyrussell]

Am thinking about installing Solar Panels and a wind generator (or 2) to try and go almost completely off the grid electric wise (even at the dock). BTW, I am not getting a tankless water heater... Just too many issues easier to just move my tank.

I can put some panels on the flybridge roof for now and later on the Bimini over the aft deck (when i build the Bimini that is)

[Silverado6x6]

I think going off the grid is an excellent idea, hopefully it will be possible in the future to have enough onboard charging equipment that a person can generate an excess and thus force the utility company to "buy back" your power. Several boaters could have their on board systems like solar panels tied together to a battery bank on dock that could then supply power during peak times or emergencies.

[Pascal]

solar panels in NY/NJ ???

that's very funny...

seriously, if you do the math (amp/hr needed per day vs what solar, and wind, will provide) you will quickly realize that it won't add up. I looked into this, and that was for South Florida!

and even if you can find enough room on your boat to mount all the solar panels, the costs will be so high that it will take 10 years to be recouped.

getting off the grid and promoting solar or wind sounds great during election campaigns... in the real world it still doens add up.

[REBrueckner]

Solar panels make some sense to keep otherwise almost idle batteries topped off at a mooring where no power is available. And maybe you could offset 1/4 or 1/3 of your daily battery charging with a big array or a wind generator while at anchor with 12volt refrigeration and LIGHT battery use..
other wise, I agree with Pascal...just too expensive....I doubt payback in even ten years is feasible yet....

[MikeP]

Have to agree with Pascal - real time solar power is, at the moment, not at all practical.

Below is an interesting article about what it would take to power a minimal "normal" house at 14.5KW use/day - a 285 sq ft solar panel - $16000 for the panel plus the necessary batteries and inverters to run the house at night. This does not include the ability to provide ANY air conditioning. To add just one small bedroom ac unit, double the size of everything

At the end they talk about that if you went to the most efficient "electrical" use mode possible and could get down to using a total of 100 watts per hour averaged over 24 hours (2.4KW), which is more like camping than what we think of as normal living, the price of electricity from the electric company to supply this would only be a bit more than 90 dollars a YEAR. Maybe solar in the NEXT century!

http://www.howstuffworks.com/question418.htm

[TedZ]

It is difficult but you certainly can take a cut at it.

These folks http://www.e-marine-inc.com/ have interesting items.

The cost/benefit ratio is a moving target...cost for power is going up, especially at marinas, and the technology is getting better. Being 100% off grid and never having to run your genny, pretty unlikely. Wind power on the boat if you are in a windy marina (who isn't!) and don't mind the aesthetics is ok...nothing is wonderful but you can go a long way.

Ted

[Sonny]

the basic rule of thumb is your battery bank should be at least 4 times larger than your average daily draw. bigger is better for a few reasons. a large battery bank simply recharges faster than a smaller one, because the larger bank has a higher acceptance than the smaller one. even deep cycle batteries really don't like being deep-cycled so if you only use the top 25% of it's capacity it will last MUCH longer than if you used 50%. finally a large battery bank simply has more reserve capacity for those days when it's cloudy and calm. so you gotta start by calculating your daily usage. check the data tags on all your stuff for wattage and amp draw and figure out how much you usually use that item in a 24 hour period, multiply by four and you got a good idea of what size battery you need. i know of a few liveaboards here who get by with a wind turbine and a small solar panel, but they live pretty minimalist lives, small tv, not many lights and a small, super-insulated icebox. solar power is still incredibly expensive when you compare $/watt and they only work for a short part of the day. wind works pretty good in most places. google yourself a wind map to see how much is available in your area. as for battery choice, lead acid is still an easy choice for me, i prefer 6v golf cart batteries. agm batteries have a better acceptance rate (recharge faster) but they have an exotic price to match the technology.
silverado mentioned selling your excess power back to the power company, i know they have this in california for sure, and in a few other states. this is great for live-aboards who are at a dock because you use the grid as your battery bank. when you are making more power than you use, your electric meter literally runs backwards. if you have enough wind you could end up with no electricity bill, avoid the expense and maintenance on a large battery bank, and keep the reliability of the grid. most people around here use air-x turbines, i can't recall the last time i saw a different brand. sunsei is the solar brand of choice, but i think that's because it's the only type the chandlery brings in.
here's a an amp-hour calculator
http://www.xantrex.com/support/howlong.asp

[Brian Degulis]

Today In South FL the technology exists to power a large home with air conditioning and all the amenities with solar power. You wouldn't be off the grid you would be selling power in the daytime then buying it back at night or on days with minimul sunshine. It's doable right now without batteries or inverters.

The problem is cost It would take anywhere from 12 to 20 years to break even. That's providing the equiptment lasts and doesn't need repair or rebuilding. And providing a hurricane doesn't rip it all to shreds. But it can be done right now and the technology should improve.

Brian

[Pascal]

teh biggest draw on the boat is refrigeration so if you really want to get off the grid, you will need to solve that problem.

the best solution will be to have a cold plate system and very thick ice boxes (4" insulation) with top loading openings. this way, you could probably keep it cold with just a couple of hours of compressor run time (off the genny)

the rest (light bulbs, pumps, etc... ) can easily be handled by solar/wind and some genny.

if you dont' mind running the genny 2 hours a day, it should supplement solar and wind adn with cold plate, it should work.

that's fine if you want to live on the hook, but i dont' see why you'd bother doing this in a marina

[REBrueckner]

Don't worry, mates, when Obama institutes "cap and trade" and wimpy republicans acquiesce, you'll see huge increases in gasoline, diesel fuel,electricity, and just about any other form of energy. His opposition to nuclear power and off shore drilling guarantees we'll have a high cost energy/power structure which will make it increasingly difficult to compete internationally. And we'll be EXTREMELY lucky if there is enough power to support a vibrant economy.....maybe then solar will be a realistic alternative...until the next ice age warning signs snow under all the man made global warming alarmists...