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  1. Cost for onboard heating

    So you are going to live aboard in a cold climate...or use heat regularly for extended periods...What's the cost comparison between diesel (oil burner) heat and electric heat?

    SUMARY: Electric heat at $.22 KWH is about two times as expensive as diesel at $4.00 per gallon. If your costs are different or you'd like to use different assumptions from mine, you can recalculate from data below.

    A big difference in cost structure is that while electric heaters are rather inexpensive initially, (maybe $20 each for four 1500 watt heaters), the cost of daily operation of electric heat is very high; with diesel heat, initial equipment cost is high but this initial cost is offset by much lower direct heating (fuel) costs.

    Note that the total heat output supplied for your comfort will be the same for all systems…In other words, if you have a large enough source to keep you, say, at 68 degrees in freezing outside temperatures, then all systems will be required to produce the same amount of total heat output over a given period of time. I used a daily comparison below, weekly or monthly or six month period would all yield the same comparison.

    Say you need heat for 6 months annually and you estimate your diesel heater will actually run 40% of the time: 6 mos x 30 days/mo x 24 hours/day x 40% is about 1700 hours annually. (I think that’s in the ballpark for my 48 ft YF in NY.)

    Total Cost Comparison

    If the diesel heating system costs, say, $7,000 to install yourself, and the heater runs the above estimated 1700 hours per year (about six months use in the NE) for 15 years, a prorated first cost equates to about $7,000/25,500 hours or $0.27/hour which is 27 cents per hour of run time.

    Daily heat for diesel is 40,000 BTU/hr x 40% x 24hrs run is 384,000 BTU/day required. Total daily Diesel cost (0.2GPH at $4.00/ gal) is $.8/hr x 40% x 24 is about $7.68. plus prorated first cost ($.27 x .4 x 24 daily) or $2.59….about $10.27 daily….

    For electric, this 384,000BTU /3,412 BTU/KWH requires 113KWH at $.22/KWHor about $25 daily. (But you would need more than one 1500 watt heater for colder portions of the heating day.)

    Total daily cost ($25 vs $10.27) means electric is about 2.5 times as expensiove as diesel with electric at $.22 KWH is and diesel at $4.00 per gallon.

    Note: (1) you can add some estimated maintenance costs for a diesel system: At 20 cents hourly, for example, about .2 x 1700 hours annually or about $340 annually daily cost increase by $.2 x (40% x 24) or $1.92...bringing daily diesel cost from $10.27 to about $12.19 vs $25 for electric...about 2 to 1.

    Note (2)
    If these figures seem high, it's because the boat in NY sits in relatively cold water which chills the fiberglass bottom and hull topsides...hence heat losses are significantly greater than in a well insulated house. Only on sub zero winter nights does the boat benefit a bit from warmer water temperastures underneath. I insulated most of my inide hull and especially the engine room and use 40 mil thick eisenglass as storm windows inside the otherwise frosty aluminum window frames...they make a BIG difference. My salon suffers from a lack of roof insulation as the roof is, I think, solid glass (no coring)...anyway, its cold.

    Note (3) If you are going to heat a 53ft or 58 ft Hatt, you'll need a Webasto 2020 or equivalent, about 90,000 BTU, in a NY/CT/ RI type climate, since interiior volume and hence heat losses will be substantially greater.
    Last edited by REBrueckner; 10-30-2008 at 02:45 PM.
    Rob Brueckner
    former 1972 48ft YF, 'Lazy Days'
    Boating isn't a matter of life and death: it's more important than that.

  2. #2

    Re: Cost for onboard heating

    It cost me $24.00 per day in propane to heat my 43dc in 32deg weather the last 2 winters. I used 2 small propane heaters. I did not heat the V-bunk area.

    BILL

  3. #3

    Re: Cost for onboard heating

    Rob,

    not totally sure yet, as first fill could be tomorrow, but the floor and insulation is helping here. Damned cold too, might turn the temp down to 65 soon (or less)

    Noel
    Noel Russell
    40' MY Aft Cabin
    Lincoln Harbor NJ

  4. Re: Cost for onboard heating

    We use a 18,000 btu heater to get the cold out, then use (are you ready for this...) WEST MARINE'S electric heaters. One in the salon and one in the stateroom.

    The Mr Heater is not expensive.

    http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/w...7957_200307957

    We use 30lb tanks using a 12' hose so as to keep the tanks in the cockpit. The downside is, The Admiral says there is a faint smell from time to time if we run it too long. (overnight is too long per her)

    But the two tanks will last the entire winter as the cold weather here is short and normally not "cold" too long.... (Cold here is under 40 degrees)

    We do have dual 16,000 reverse cycle ac/heat units. And untill the water temp gets too cold they are great. Most of the time the unit for the stateroom is too much which is why we use the West Marine units.

    http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs...2&classNum=543

    Am guessing we have tried somewhere between 10-12 other electric heaters, none we were happy about but the West Marine ones have done the job. Even have several other liveaboards here using them.
    Last edited by Jaxfishgyd; 10-30-2008 at 03:39 PM.
    Charlie Freeman
    "No Dial Tone"
    1973 43' DCMY
    Fernandina Beach, Fl
    www.yachtmoves.com

  5. #5

    Re: Cost for onboard heating

    Charlie,

    Yesterday below 40 was daytime up here. LOL

    Noel
    Noel Russell
    40' MY Aft Cabin
    Lincoln Harbor NJ

  6. #6

    Re: Cost for onboard heating

    I run heat about 3-4 nights per year. Mine is electric - reverse AC - and costs me nothing extra. Electricity is included in my slip fee which is a good thing because in the summer, I have 7 AC units running! Man, I don't miss the Great White North!

    Yeah, yeah...this doesn't count...I paid my dues up north freezing my tail off in the winters, so I get to rub it in a little now.
    Ang
    1980 58MY "Sanctuary"
    www.sanctuarycharteryacht.com

  7. #7

    Re: Cost for onboard heating

    Dang Ang,

    Must see the Sanctuary when i get south this January. As for heat, think about paying your dues with a warm floor in the am/pm . much easier to take

    Noel
    Noel Russell
    40' MY Aft Cabin
    Lincoln Harbor NJ

  8. #8

    Re: Cost for onboard heating

    I lived aboard a 43 Pearson MY for ten years in New York City. During that time, I found to heat the boat with diesel I needed about 330 gallons of fuel each year. During the 4th year I pumped foam into every wall and deck I could. This resulted in a savings of about 60 gallons per year.

    I had also found the one place that most of the heat loss on board is the glass. So if you can for the winter or the coldest spells insulate the glass or at least some of it.

    I can also tell you about another live aboard at Worlds Fair Marina. He left his boat for the weekend in December ’89, a cold month with many days below 30 degrees as the high. The boat heated with electric. In the absence of the owner the boat lost power and many water pipes burst.

    It is for this reason I’m a fan of oil heat that uses DC power, i.e. Espar or Wabosto. I favor Espar, but recommend you get the product that has good service in your area.

    With either of the above with reasonable batteries you can get by for several days without the dock power. I had 2 group 31 deep cycle batteries running a 28,000 BTU unit. This arrangement could run the boat’s heating system for 5 days starting with a full charge.

    These units also lend them selves well to the live aboard environment. The size is right, forced hot air in a sometimes damp setting is helpful and both use a downdraft chimney. The 28,000 BTU unit I used had a 1” exhaust.

    I still miss living aboard, I had to move ashore to start and raise a family. The funny thing is I now have the boat I always wanted because I lived aboard, 58YF, and I live on land. Gofigure.

    JM

  9. #9

    Re: Cost for onboard heating

    Espars are okay, but I have found that they have more ignition problems than the Webasto. The Espars are expensive to repair too.
    Sky Cheney
    1985 53EDMY, Hull #CN759, "Rebecca"
    ELYC on White Lake--Montague, MI

  10. #10

    Re: Cost for onboard heating

    You missed one, A Hurricane II heater from ITR which we use aboard. And I might not be burning exactly that amount it is still a fun time to refuel. As for Insulation, I am using the same as when I installed the radiant floor. As for the thought of electric going, guess what... They all need electric to run. Unless of course they start the generator.
    Noel Russell
    40' MY Aft Cabin
    Lincoln Harbor NJ

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